Re: Réf. : Re: Réf. : RE: Réf. : Sury
Okay, so the misperception was about the names; the patent copies on
your website is in fact the same patent that is used to make the
pictures shown, and the process is called the Sury Color Process.
Thanks for clearing up the confusion.
I was apparently mistaking the patent Richard described with the
patent someone else (Dave? Judy?) described, for a color process that
seemed possibly to resemble a resinotype.
Katharine
On Jan 2, 2008, at 11:12 AM, Philippe Berger wrote:
Katharine,
which I gather from Richard's description uses
three color separation negatives, and a colloid over cyanotype mixed-
process for the three color printings
This is a other patent of Joseph Sury in 1908
I am also this patent (10 pages)
*****
What confuses me is that the pictures show the temporary blue pigment
being removed by acid; is that also a feature of the resinotype Sury
Color Process? Or is it that Phillipe's process isn't a direct
translation of either of Sury's patents but his own process that sort
of takes from both? Or something else, like the names of the
processes have been mixed up or something.
By the way, if anyone's interested in trying this (the method
described in the patent on the website), sodium aluminum
sulfosilicate is ultramarine blue.
This is the patent of the Color process of 1924, do you see on my
Website
See the 3 picture on my web site with a demonstration
1 Blue picture
2.The picture without the blue
3. Add the dry pigment
Are you see the difference
Philippe
-------Message original-------
De : Katharine Thayer
Date : 01/02/08 19:52:55
A : alt-photo-process-l@usask.ca
Sujet : Re: Réf. : RE: Réf. : Sury
I think I need some clarification. My understanding, reading
through this thread, is that the pictures on Philippe's website, both
from Sury and from Phillipe, are made from the process called the
Sury Color Process, which I gather from Richard's description uses
three color separation negatives, and a colloid over cyanotype mixed-
process for the three color printings.
But the patent that Phillipe so thoughtfully put on the website for
us to read, is a patent for a different process involving a prepared
paper coated with a colloid mixed with a temporary blue pigment. A
dichromate solution is coated over the paper to sensitize it and the
paper is exposed, developed and dried, then the blue pigment is
removed by putting the paper in hydrochloric acid, which makes the
dried colloid receptive to powdered pigment.
What confuses me is that the pictures show the temporary blue pigment
being removed by acid; is that also a feature of the resinotype Sury
Color Process? Or is it that Phillipe's process isn't a direct
translation of either of Sury's patents but his own process that sort
of takes from both? Or something else, like the names of the
processes have been mixed up or something.
By the way, if anyone's interested in trying this (the method
described in the patent on the website), sodium aluminum
sulfosilicate is ultramarine blue.
Katharine
On Dec 31, 2007, at 9:45 PM, Richard Knoppow wrote:
>
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Philippe Berger"
> <mineurdecharbon@skynet.be>
> To: <alt-photo-process-l@usask.ca>
> Sent: Sunday, December 30, 2007 1:15 PM
> Subject: Réf. : RE: Réf. : Sury
>
>
> Marek,
>
> The sury color is not a real tricolor, the sury color is different
> of a
> carbon Black
> The Sury Color is only a Sury Color, a process of Joseph Sury of
1924
>
> Philippe
>
>
> I was not able to find a Sury patent dated 1924 but found an
> earlier one as noted in a previous post. The earlier patent is for
> three-color printing from color separation negatives using a
> combination of cyanotype for the blue image and some sort of resin,
> gum or something else not specified, for the other two colors. Sury
> distinguishes this method from an "assembled" method such as three-
> color carbon. This may not be the method being described here.
> The sample on your web site is quite interesting. I downloaded it
> and, out of curiosity, manipulated it in Photoshop using the auto
> level or the auto-color commands. The results are about the same
> and quite interesting because they get rid of the yellow overall
> cast and bring out a great deal of subtle color which the overall
> color suppresses. I wonder what it was intended to look like.
> I agree with Judy that it is reminscent of a style popular in the
> 1920's but, to my eye, looks much like a good pencil portrait. The
> pose and lighting are far better than most of the "pictorialist"
> stuff from that period. It is in fact a beautiful portrait of a
> quite beautiful girl and quite fascinating regardless of what
> process it may have been made with.
>
> ---
> Richard Knoppow
> Los Angeles, CA, USA
> dickburk@ix.netcom.com
>
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