From christinazanderson at gmail.com Mon Jul 1 15:37:38 2013 From: christinazanderson at gmail.com (Christina Anderson) Date: Mon, 1 Jul 2013 09:37:38 -0600 Subject: [Alt-photo] APIS 2013 Message-ID: Dear All, Summer is glorious, isn't it? I just can't get enough of this free time stuff. Great time to create work and write. Not to harsh anybody's mellow and bring up fall, but I just noticed today that APIS is up on the web, coming up in October, and that, wonder of wonders, Bob Kiss, I will finally get to meet you after "knowing" you for a decade on the list! I had a student doing uranotypes, so will be interested to see what you have discovered. Unfortunately he moved back to Sweden/Iceland so I don't imagine he will be attending. http://www.bostick-sullivan.com/cart/product.php?productid=1201&cat=429&page=1 Chris Christina Z. Anderson christinaZanderson.com From bobkiss at caribsurf.com Mon Jul 1 16:27:47 2013 From: bobkiss at caribsurf.com (KISS BOB) Date: Mon, 01 Jul 2013 12:27:47 -0400 Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: APIS 2013 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: DEAR CHRISTINA, Actually, unless an "angel" lands on me before Oct, I won't be at APIS in person but in video form. B&S doesn't pay airfares and, as I am located in Barbados, I don't have access as you do to Southwest or other discount airlines. It would cost me around $2,000 US round trip to get there and then room and board on top of that. My intentions are to make and send up prints along with a video of me making the prints. Melody and I have also discussed setting up a Skype link for Q&A. And all of my fund raising efforts are going toward my show that will open on Sept 7th of 20 large pt/pd prints of chattel houses at City Gallery at Waterfront Park in Charleston SC. At the opening Prof. Henry Fraser (who wrote the text accompanying more than 100 of my chattel house photos) and I will be signing books as well. This will run concurrently with the JUMA arts festival. This should be a special show because two Carolina photographers who have made images of the Gullah people (related to Barbadians) and of houses and churches in the Carolinas that look exactly like our chattel houses, will also be showing. The whole purpose of the show will be to emphasize the 4 century old relationship between the Carolinas and Barbados in the form of The Legacy Foundation of Barbados and the Caroliinas. Again, airfares between Barbados and SC are very high and we must remain for a few days to give lectures and interviews so we are flat out trying to raise funds to cover everything for this. Just in case my summer was going to be boring... LOL!!! CHEERS! BOB On Mon, 1 Jul 2013 09:37:38 -0600 Christina Anderson wrote: > Dear All, > > Summer is glorious, isn't it? I just can't get enough of >this free time stuff. Great time to create work and >write. > > Not to harsh anybody's mellow and bring up fall, but I >just noticed today that APIS is up on the web, coming up >in October, and that, wonder of wonders, Bob Kiss, I will >finally get to meet you after "knowing" you for a decade >on the list! I had a student doing uranotypes, so will >be interested to see what you have discovered. >Unfortunately he moved back to Sweden/Iceland so I don't >imagine he will be attending. > > http://www.bostick-sullivan.com/cart/product.php?productid=1201&cat=429&page=1 > > Chris > > > Christina Z. Anderson > christinaZanderson.com > > _______________________________________________ > Alt-photo-process-list | >lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo From christinazanderson at gmail.com Mon Jul 1 17:10:55 2013 From: christinazanderson at gmail.com (Christina Anderson) Date: Mon, 1 Jul 2013 11:10:55 -0600 Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: APIS 2013 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Bummer that you won't be there in person but I feel your pain. If it is any consolation, there are no cheap flights nor airlines out of Bozeman. I do hope you do a Skype Q&A, as it costs nothing. Your show sounds fascinating! I bet a lot of alt people in SC/NC area will attend and I will pass on the word. Good luck with the fundraising. You would think there might be NEH grants or something to back your project as it revolves around preserving culture. Chris Christina Z. Anderson christinaZanderson.com On Jul 1, 2013, at 10:27 AM, KISS BOB wrote: > DEAR CHRISTINA, > Actually, unless an "angel" lands on me before Oct, I won't be at APIS in person but in video form. B&S doesn't pay airfares and, as I am located in Barbados, I don't have access as you do to Southwest or other discount airlines. It would cost me around $2,000 US round trip to get there and then room and board on top of that. > My intentions are to make and send up prints along with a video of me making the prints. Melody and I have also discussed setting up a Skype link for Q&A. > And all of my fund raising efforts are going toward my show that will open on Sept 7th of 20 large pt/pd prints of chattel houses at City Gallery at Waterfront Park in Charleston SC. At the opening Prof. Henry Fraser (who wrote the text accompanying more than 100 of my chattel house photos) and I will be signing books as well. This will run concurrently with the JUMA arts festival. This should be a special show because two Carolina photographers who have made images of the Gullah people (related to Barbadians) and of houses and churches in the Carolinas that look exactly like our chattel houses, will also be showing. The whole purpose of the show will be to emphasize the 4 century old relationship between the Carolinas and Barbados in the form of The Legacy Foundation of Barbados and the Caroliinas. Again, airfares between Barbados and SC are very high and we must remain for a few days to give lectures and interviews so we are flat out trying to raise funds to cover everything for this. > Just in case my summer was going to be boring... LOL!!! > CHEERS! > BOB > > > > On Mon, 1 Jul 2013 09:37:38 -0600 > Christina Anderson wrote: >> Dear All, >> Summer is glorious, isn't it? I just can't get enough of this free time stuff. Great time to create work and write. >> Not to harsh anybody's mellow and bring up fall, but I just noticed today that APIS is up on the web, coming up in October, and that, wonder of wonders, Bob Kiss, I will finally get to meet you after "knowing" you for a decade on the list! I had a student doing uranotypes, so will be interested to see what you have discovered. Unfortunately he moved back to Sweden/Iceland so I don't imagine he will be attending. >> http://www.bostick-sullivan.com/cart/product.php?productid=1201&cat=429&page=1 >> Chris >> Christina Z. Anderson >> christinaZanderson.com >> _______________________________________________ >> Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo > > _______________________________________________ > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo From emanphoto at gmail.com Tue Jul 2 07:18:42 2013 From: emanphoto at gmail.com (eric nelson) Date: Tue, 2 Jul 2013 14:18:42 +0700 Subject: [Alt-photo] Thailand Chemical Suppliers Message-ID: I've been pursuing chemical suppliers here over the past year through as many sources as I can think of, from a brother-in-law who is a senior deputy managing director for a large chemical import company, to Thai B&W forums where I can't read a lick. FYI Google Translate just makes a mess of Thai translations. I'd hoped the alt-list here might have some leads, but Thailand doesn't seem represented here. Thank you to those who've tried! So, for a record to help anyone in a similar boat now or in the future, here are the Thailand chemical suppliers I've been directed to, although I've not talked to them directly or priced out any compounds yet. I've been lucky in that I've been warmly welcomed to the http://www.bwthai.org forum with several helpful suggestions. I hope my contact with these companies will prove fruitful! *http://mavidon.com/index.php/distributors?cid=TH* *Teo Hong Silom Co., Ltd.* Nuvadee at teohong.com[ Send Email ] Bangna Tower-B, 17th Floor 2/3 Moo 14 Bangna-Trad K.M.6.5 Bangkaew Thailand,,10540 Phone:66-0-2312-004569 Products: Collodion Remover Collodion USP *Civic Corporation Limited* chaiwat.civic at gmail.com[ Send Email ] 1792 Rama 4 Road Khet Klongtoey Thailand,,10110 Phone:66-2249-3583 Products: LemonPrep(tm) Collodion USP Collodion A10 *???????1986* (Ruam_Che_Me 1986) http://www.ucs1986.com/about%20us.htm 0-2224-1822-4 ,0-2224-1803-4 Fax 0-2224 -6501 *???.?????????????? *(chai_su_wan_hy_po) intersection between charoen_krung Rd. and Silom Rd. 1338 ????????????, ??????????????, ??? Tel : 234-7886, 235-1189 Tossing in a few keywords here to help in future Googles. Thailand alt photo, Thailand chemical suppliers, Thailand chemicals, Thailand analog, Thailand B&W -- Eric Nelson Photography 086 343 1612 http://ericnelsonphoto.tumblr.com/ https://www.facebook.com/EricNelsonPhotographyBangkok From gerryyaum at gmail.com Tue Jul 2 10:07:05 2013 From: gerryyaum at gmail.com (Gerry Yaum) Date: Tue, 2 Jul 2013 04:07:05 -0600 Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: Thailand Chemical Suppliers In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Thanks very much Eric..this could be very useful for my future projects. Gerry www.gerryyaum.blogspot.com On Tue, Jul 2, 2013 at 1:18 AM, eric nelson wrote: > I've been pursuing chemical suppliers here over the past year through as > many sources as I can think of, from a brother-in-law who is a senior > deputy managing director for a large chemical import company, to Thai B&W > forums where I can't read a lick. FYI Google Translate just makes a mess > of Thai translations. I'd hoped the alt-list here might have some leads, > but Thailand doesn't seem represented here. Thank you to those who've > tried! > > So, for a record to help anyone in a similar boat now or in the future, > here are the Thailand chemical suppliers I've been directed to, although > I've not talked to them directly or priced out any compounds yet. > I've been lucky in that I've been warmly welcomed to the > http://www.bwthai.org forum with several helpful suggestions. I hope my > contact with these companies will prove fruitful! > > *http://mavidon.com/index.php/distributors?cid=TH*< > http://mavidon.com/index.php/distributors?cid=TH> > > *Teo Hong Silom Co., Ltd.* > Nuvadee at teohong.com[ Send Email ] > Bangna Tower-B, 17th Floor 2/3 Moo 14 Bangna-Trad K.M.6.5 Bangkaew > Thailand,,10540 > Phone:66-0-2312-004569 > Products: > Collodion Remover > Collodion USP > > *Civic Corporation Limited* > chaiwat.civic at gmail.com[ Send Email ] > 1792 Rama 4 Road Khet Klongtoey > Thailand,,10110 > Phone:66-2249-3583 > Products: > LemonPrep(tm) > Collodion USP > Collodion A10 > > > > *???????1986* (Ruam_Che_Me 1986) http://www.ucs1986.com/about%20us.htm > 0-2224-1822-4 ,0-2224-1803-4 Fax 0-2224 -6501 > > *???.?????????????? *(chai_su_wan_hy_po) intersection between charoen_krung > Rd. and Silom Rd. > 1338 ????????????, ??????????????, ??? > Tel : 234-7886, 235-1189 > > > Tossing in a few keywords here to help in future Googles. > Thailand alt photo, Thailand chemical suppliers, Thailand > chemicals, Thailand analog, Thailand B&W > > > > -- > Eric Nelson Photography > 086 343 1612 > http://ericnelsonphoto.tumblr.com/ > https://www.facebook.com/EricNelsonPhotographyBangkok > _______________________________________________ > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo From christinazanderson at gmail.com Tue Jul 2 15:12:35 2013 From: christinazanderson at gmail.com (Christina Anderson) Date: Tue, 2 Jul 2013 09:12:35 -0600 Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: Gum coating video In-Reply-To: References: , , <13E40A95-AB58-44E2-BFAB-6AC9CE966C3C@clemson.edu>, , <5883FBF6-383F-4541-85A0-713123F78743@gmail.com>, <6CE1ED4DD0E94DC4B223D9F411814597@FireBreather>, , <010101ce6ecf$55f6db10$01e49130$@net>, , , <0AD0D39F-B0E4-421D-A802-518DF67ECDE4@gmail.com>, , <668E39D4-B500-453D-9F2E-2DE81CB15E1E@gmail.com> Message-ID: <4F74C651-0B0B-4ECC-B9DA-A03221E62713@gmail.com> Marek, I loved seeing you work and talk! It is how I remember your personality when I first met you at Clay Harmon's years ago. That image, BTW, is gorgeous. I hope you put it on Flicker or something when it is done. You do really well with flowers, but that one particularly well in its gangliness and how you have framed it. I see that you brush first and then roller. That is interesting. You also brush and roller very gently. I am always amazed at how different people coat paper. I remember a couple scenarios: a student who was like attacking the paper with the brush and I had to tell her whoooooaaa.... Then Livick's use of the air spray gun and Judy Siegel's cautions still ringing in my ear about airborne dichromate. I have been very tempted, actually, to buy an air gun and test it out and still wonder if her cautions are overblown. Anyone know if Livick is still alive? I heard he quit gum. I always preferred the hake brush because of the borders, but now I mat out my borders so that would not matter anymore. My problem with the roller has been the streaks that have been left behind in the way I use it, streaks that come from the side of the roller and look very interruptive. I noticed when I rollered over and over and finer and finer the streaks disappeared, and with large works I bet a roller is the way to go, but for me and small works a damp hake followed by a dry hake do it all. There is a difference for me between brushing gum and brushing casein, too. I brush far longer with casein and far more vigorously. It doesn't get "sticky" like gum does...gum at a certain point gets tacky and you know it's getting time to quit brushing. Casein gets grabby. I can't quite describe it well but if I don't have the brush marks out of a casein print at a certain point it is no go after that. I also go through many brushes in a day. I will do a set of 4-8 casein prints using one wet brush and several dry, then while those are soaking I will do another layer on another set. By the end of the day I can have 20 hake brushes drying! Luckily the ones I use are cheap and they last for years. Chris Christina Z. Anderson christinaZanderson.com On Jun 22, 2013, at 1:08 PM, Marek Matusz wrote: > > > While I was coating my yellow gum layer today I remembered that Chris mentioned that she has no luck using rollers. SO I filmed it and here it is. My way of coating with rollers. I know that many on the list are using foam rollers and there is nothing new here, but maybe somebody can learn.It was fun making the video, now to exposing and development.https://plus.google.com/photos/105732508998271877151/albums/5882305049320410433 Marek > _______________________________________________ > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo From bobkiss at caribsurf.com Tue Jul 2 17:34:49 2013 From: bobkiss at caribsurf.com (BOB KISS) Date: Tue, 2 Jul 2013 13:34:49 -0400 Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: CORRECTION Re: APIS 2013 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: DEAR CHRISTINA, The arts Festival in Charleston is called the MOJA festival, not the JUMA festival as I state below. Sorry! Sleep deprivation! CHEERS! BOB -----Original Message----- From: alt-photo-process-list-bounces at lists.altphotolist.org [mailto:alt-photo-process-list-bounces at lists.altphotolist.org] On Behalf Of Christina Anderson Sent: Monday, July 01, 2013 1:11 PM To: alt-photo-process-list at lists.altphotolist.org Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: APIS 2013 Bummer that you won't be there in person but I feel your pain. If it is any consolation, there are no cheap flights nor airlines out of Bozeman. I do hope you do a Skype Q&A, as it costs nothing. Your show sounds fascinating! I bet a lot of alt people in SC/NC area will attend and I will pass on the word. Good luck with the fundraising. You would think there might be NEH grants or something to back your project as it revolves around preserving culture. Chris Christina Z. Anderson christinaZanderson.com On Jul 1, 2013, at 10:27 AM, KISS BOB wrote: > DEAR CHRISTINA, > Actually, unless an "angel" lands on me before Oct, I won't be at APIS in person but in video form. B&S doesn't pay airfares and, as I am located in Barbados, I don't have access as you do to Southwest or other discount airlines. It would cost me around $2,000 US round trip to get there and then room and board on top of that. > My intentions are to make and send up prints along with a video of me making the prints. Melody and I have also discussed setting up a Skype link for Q&A. > And all of my fund raising efforts are going toward my show that will open on Sept 7th of 20 large pt/pd prints of chattel houses at City Gallery at Waterfront Park in Charleston SC. At the opening Prof. Henry Fraser (who wrote the text accompanying more than 100 of my chattel house photos) and I will be signing books as well. This will run concurrently with the JUMA arts festival. This should be a special show because two Carolina photographers who have made images of the Gullah people (related to Barbadians) and of houses and churches in the Carolinas that look exactly like our chattel houses, will also be showing. The whole purpose of the show will be to emphasize the 4 century old relationship between the Carolinas and Barbados in the form of The Legacy Foundation of Barbados and the Caroliinas. Again, airfares between Barbados and SC are very high and we must remain for a few days to give lectures and interviews so we are flat out trying to raise funds to cover everything for this. > Just in case my summer was going to be boring... LOL!!! > CHEERS! > BOB > > > > On Mon, 1 Jul 2013 09:37:38 -0600 > Christina Anderson wrote: >> Dear All, >> Summer is glorious, isn't it? I just can't get enough of this free time stuff. Great time to create work and write. >> Not to harsh anybody's mellow and bring up fall, but I just noticed today that APIS is up on the web, coming up in October, and that, wonder of wonders, Bob Kiss, I will finally get to meet you after "knowing" you for a decade on the list! I had a student doing uranotypes, so will be interested to see what you have discovered. Unfortunately he moved back to Sweden/Iceland so I don't imagine he will be attending. >> http://www.bostick-sullivan.com/cart/product.php?productid=1201&cat=429&page =1 >> Chris >> Christina Z. Anderson >> christinaZanderson.com >> _______________________________________________ >> Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo > > _______________________________________________ > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo _______________________________________________ Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo __________ Information from ESET Smart Security, version of virus signature database 8514 (20130701) __________ The message was checked by ESET Smart Security. http://www.eset.com From marekmatusz at hotmail.com Wed Jul 3 23:26:12 2013 From: marekmatusz at hotmail.com (Marek Matusz) Date: Wed, 3 Jul 2013 23:26:12 +0000 Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: Gum coating video In-Reply-To: <4F74C651-0B0B-4ECC-B9DA-A03221E62713@gmail.com> References: , , , , <13E40A95-AB58-44E2-BFAB-6AC9CE966C3C@clemson.edu>, , , , <5883FBF6-383F-4541-85A0-713123F78743@gmail.com>, , <6CE1ED4DD0E94DC4B223D9F411814597@FireBreather>, , , , <010101ce6ecf$55f6db10$01e49130$@net>, , , , , , <0AD0D39F-B0E4-421D-A802-518DF67ECDE4@gmail.com>, , , , <668E39D4-B500-453D-9F2E-2DE81CB15E1E@gmail.com>, , <4F74C651-0B0B-4ECC-B9DA-A03221E62713@gmail.com> Message-ID: Chris, Delighted to hear from you again. I was worried by your silence. TO comment on the roller, it is so fast and efficient I'd never go back on it. Rolling in one direction, while I do it in the video, but forgot to elaborate on it is essential as it helps distribute emulsion evenly. Rolling the sponge on the dry towel at the angle to take away excess gum from the edge of the roller is another trick. Learning with a dark color like blue or black helps. I would strongly advise not to do any spraying of dichromate solutions unless you do have proper protective equipment and that would mean proper mask (not the home depot dust mask) to begin with. The roller can produce amazingly even coatings. I finished the print in video and posted it on line together with the original full color version https://plus.google.com/photos/105732508998271877151/albums/5882305049320410433 Enjoy I am off to printing another floral in my new found gum a la Chia (my work flow does not resemble much of her description anymore, but the spirit of the work flow is the same. Marek > From: christinazanderson at gmail.com > Date: Tue, 2 Jul 2013 09:12:35 -0600 > To: alt-photo-process-list at lists.altphotolist.org > Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: Gum coating video > > Marek, > > I loved seeing you work and talk! It is how I remember your personality when I first met you at Clay Harmon's years ago. > > That image, BTW, is gorgeous. I hope you put it on Flicker or something when it is done. You do really well with flowers, but that one particularly well in its gangliness and how you have framed it. > > I see that you brush first and then roller. That is interesting. You also brush and roller very gently. > > I am always amazed at how different people coat paper. I remember a couple scenarios: a student who was like attacking the paper with the brush and I had to tell her whoooooaaa.... > > Then Livick's use of the air spray gun and Judy Siegel's cautions still ringing in my ear about airborne dichromate. I have been very tempted, actually, to buy an air gun and test it out and still wonder if her cautions are overblown. Anyone know if Livick is still alive? I heard he quit gum. > > I always preferred the hake brush because of the borders, but now I mat out my borders so that would not matter anymore. My problem with the roller has been the streaks that have been left behind in the way I use it, streaks that come from the side of the roller and look very interruptive. I noticed when I rollered over and over and finer and finer the streaks disappeared, and with large works I bet a roller is the way to go, but for me and small works a damp hake followed by a dry hake do it all. > > There is a difference for me between brushing gum and brushing casein, too. I brush far longer with casein and far more vigorously. It doesn't get "sticky" like gum does...gum at a certain point gets tacky and you know it's getting time to quit brushing. Casein gets grabby. I can't quite describe it well but if I don't have the brush marks out of a casein print at a certain point it is no go after that. I also go through many brushes in a day. I will do a set of 4-8 casein prints using one wet brush and several dry, then while those are soaking I will do another layer on another set. By the end of the day I can have 20 hake brushes drying! Luckily the ones I use are cheap and they last for years. > > Chris > > > Christina Z. Anderson > christinaZanderson.com > > On Jun 22, 2013, at 1:08 PM, Marek Matusz wrote: > > > > > > > While I was coating my yellow gum layer today I remembered that Chris mentioned that she has no luck using rollers. SO I filmed it and here it is. My way of coating with rollers. I know that many on the list are using foam rollers and there is nothing new here, but maybe somebody can learn.It was fun making the video, now to exposing and development.https://plus.google.com/photos/105732508998271877151/albums/5882305049320410433 Marek > > _______________________________________________ > > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo > > _______________________________________________ > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo From john at johnbrewerphotography.com Thu Jul 4 12:18:10 2013 From: john at johnbrewerphotography.com (John Brewer) Date: Thu, 4 Jul 2013 13:18:10 +0100 Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: Gum coating video In-Reply-To: References: <13E40A95-AB58-44E2-BFAB-6AC9CE966C3C@clemson.edu> <5883FBF6-383F-4541-85A0-713123F78743@gmail.com> <6CE1ED4DD0E94DC4B223D9F411814597@FireBreather> <010101ce6ecf$55f6db10$01e49130$@net> <0AD0D39F-B0E4-421D-A802-518DF67ECDE4@gmail.com> <668E39D4-B500-453D-9F2E-2DE81CB15E1E@gmail.com> <4F74C651-0B0B-4ECC-B9DA-A03221E62713@gmail.com> Message-ID: Great video Marek, thanks for sharing. It's always interesting to see how other people gum. John. On 4 July 2013 00:26, Marek Matusz wrote: > Chris, > > Delighted to hear from you again. I was worried by your silence. TO > comment on the roller, it is so fast and efficient I'd never go back on it. > Rolling in one direction, while I do it in the video, but forgot to > elaborate on it is essential as it helps distribute emulsion evenly. > Rolling the sponge on the dry towel at the angle to take away excess gum > from the edge of the roller is another trick. Learning with a dark color > like blue or black helps. > > I would strongly advise not to do any spraying of dichromate solutions > unless you do have proper protective equipment and that would mean proper > mask (not the home depot dust mask) to begin with. The roller can produce > amazingly even coatings. > > I finished the print in video and posted it on line together with the > original full color version > > > https://plus.google.com/photos/105732508998271877151/albums/5882305049320410433 > > Enjoy > I am off to printing another floral in my new found gum a la Chia (my work > flow does not resemble much of her description anymore, but the spirit of > the work flow is the same. > > Marek > > > > > From: christinazanderson at gmail.com > > Date: Tue, 2 Jul 2013 09:12:35 -0600 > > To: alt-photo-process-list at lists.altphotolist.org > > Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: Gum coating video > > > > Marek, > > > > I loved seeing you work and talk! It is how I remember your personality > when I first met you at Clay Harmon's years ago. > > > > That image, BTW, is gorgeous. I hope you put it on Flicker or something > when it is done. You do really well with flowers, but that one particularly > well in its gangliness and how you have framed it. > > > > I see that you brush first and then roller. That is interesting. You > also brush and roller very gently. > > > > I am always amazed at how different people coat paper. I remember a > couple scenarios: a student who was like attacking the paper with the brush > and I had to tell her whoooooaaa.... > > > > Then Livick's use of the air spray gun and Judy Siegel's cautions still > ringing in my ear about airborne dichromate. I have been very tempted, > actually, to buy an air gun and test it out and still wonder if her > cautions are overblown. Anyone know if Livick is still alive? I heard he > quit gum. > > > > I always preferred the hake brush because of the borders, but now I mat > out my borders so that would not matter anymore. My problem with the roller > has been the streaks that have been left behind in the way I use it, > streaks that come from the side of the roller and look very interruptive. I > noticed when I rollered over and over and finer and finer the streaks > disappeared, and with large works I bet a roller is the way to go, but for > me and small works a damp hake followed by a dry hake do it all. > > > > There is a difference for me between brushing gum and brushing casein, > too. I brush far longer with casein and far more vigorously. It doesn't get > "sticky" like gum does...gum at a certain point gets tacky and you know > it's getting time to quit brushing. Casein gets grabby. I can't quite > describe it well but if I don't have the brush marks out of a casein print > at a certain point it is no go after that. I also go through many brushes > in a day. I will do a set of 4-8 casein prints using one wet brush and > several dry, then while those are soaking I will do another layer on > another set. By the end of the day I can have 20 hake brushes drying! > Luckily the ones I use are cheap and they last for years. > > > > Chris > > > > > > Christina Z. Anderson > > christinaZanderson.com > > > > On Jun 22, 2013, at 1:08 PM, Marek Matusz wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > While I was coating my yellow gum layer today I remembered that Chris > mentioned that she has no luck using rollers. SO I filmed it and here it > is. My way of coating with rollers. I know that many on the list are using > foam rollers and there is nothing new here, but maybe somebody can learn.It > was fun making the video, now to exposing and development. > https://plus.google.com/photos/105732508998271877151/albums/5882305049320410433Marek > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo > > _______________________________________________ > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo > -- John Brewer www.johnbrewerphotography.com workshops:equipment sales:chemistry sales From marekmatusz at hotmail.com Sat Jul 6 00:29:04 2013 From: marekmatusz at hotmail.com (Marek Matusz) Date: Sat, 6 Jul 2013 00:29:04 +0000 Subject: [Alt-photo] Ultrafine transparency In-Reply-To: References: , , <13E40A95-AB58-44E2-BFAB-6AC9CE966C3C@clemson.edu>, , <5883FBF6-383F-4541-85A0-713123F78743@gmail.com>, <6CE1ED4DD0E94DC4B223D9F411814597@FireBreather>, Message-ID: Jeremy, I ran out of my old ultrafine transparency, but photowarehouse now lists Ultrafine Waterproof Inkjet Film. Is that what you are buying now? Did you try printing negatives on it yet? Is this the same as the old material or better (in terms of ink holding capacity) . I want to buy a pack of large size sheets and want to make sure I get the right stuff before I spent $100. Marek From pfriedrichsen at sympatico.ca Sat Jul 6 02:22:03 2013 From: pfriedrichsen at sympatico.ca (Peter Friedrichsen) Date: Fri, 5 Jul 2013 22:22:03 -0400 Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: Gum coating video In-Reply-To: <4F74C651-0B0B-4ECC-B9DA-A03221E62713@gmail.com> References: <13E40A95-AB58-44E2-BFAB-6AC9CE966C3C@clemson.edu> <5883FBF6-383F-4541-85A0-713123F78743@gmail.com> <6CE1ED4DD0E94DC4B223D9F411814597@FireBreather> <010101ce6ecf$55f6db10$01e49130$@net> <0AD0D39F-B0E4-421D-A802-518DF67ECDE4@gmail.com> <668E39D4-B500-453D-9F2E-2DE81CB15E1E@gmail.com> <4F74C651-0B0B-4ECC-B9DA-A03221E62713@gmail.com> Message-ID: Steven Livick is still producing mural sized prints but they are digitally printed. Peter Friedrichsen On 2013-07-02, at 11:12 AM, Christina Anderson wrote: > Marek, > > I loved seeing you work and talk! It is how I remember your personality when I first met you at Clay Harmon's years ago. > > That image, BTW, is gorgeous. I hope you put it on Flicker or something when it is done. You do really well with flowers, but that one particularly well in its gangliness and how you have framed it. > > I see that you brush first and then roller. That is interesting. You also brush and roller very gently. > > I am always amazed at how different people coat paper. I remember a couple scenarios: a student who was like attacking the paper with the brush and I had to tell her whoooooaaa.... > > Then Livick's use of the air spray gun and Judy Siegel's cautions still ringing in my ear about airborne dichromate. I have been very tempted, actually, to buy an air gun and test it out and still wonder if her cautions are overblown. Anyone know if Livick is still alive? I heard he quit gum. > > I always preferred the hake brush because of the borders, but now I mat out my borders so that would not matter anymore. My problem with the roller has been the streaks that have been left behind in the way I use it, streaks that come from the side of the roller and look very interruptive. I noticed when I rollered over and over and finer and finer the streaks disappeared, and with large works I bet a roller is the way to go, but for me and small works a damp hake followed by a dry hake do it all. > > There is a difference for me between brushing gum and brushing casein, too. I brush far longer with casein and far more vigorously. It doesn't get "sticky" like gum does...gum at a certain point gets tacky and you know it's getting time to quit brushing. Casein gets grabby. I can't quite describe it well but if I don't have the brush marks out of a casein print at a certain point it is no go after that. I also go through many brushes in a day. I will do a set of 4-8 casein prints using one wet brush and several dry, then while those are soaking I will do another layer on another set. By the end of the day I can have 20 hake brushes drying! Luckily the ones I use are cheap and they last for years. > > Chris > > > Christina Z. Anderson > christinaZanderson.com > > On Jun 22, 2013, at 1:08 PM, Marek Matusz wrote: > >> >> >> While I was coating my yellow gum layer today I remembered that Chris mentioned that she has no luck using rollers. SO I filmed it and here it is. My way of coating with rollers. I know that many on the list are using foam rollers and there is nothing new here, but maybe somebody can learn.It was fun making the video, now to exposing and development.https://plus.google.com/photos/105732508998271877151/albums/5882305049320410433 Marek >> _______________________________________________ >> Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo > > _______________________________________________ > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo > From sanking at clemson.edu Sat Jul 6 05:17:21 2013 From: sanking at clemson.edu (Sandy King) Date: Sat, 6 Jul 2013 01:17:21 -0400 Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: Gum coating video In-Reply-To: <4F74C651-0B0B-4ECC-B9DA-A03221E62713@gmail.com> References: , , <13E40A95-AB58-44E2-BFAB-6AC9CE966C3C@clemson.edu>, , <5883FBF6-383F-4541-85A0-713123F78743@gmail.com>, <6CE1ED4DD0E94DC4B223D9F411814597@FireBreather>, , <010101ce6ecf$55f6db10$01e49130$@net>, , , <0AD0D39F-B0E4-421D-A802-518DF67ECDE4@gmail.com>, , <668E39D4-B500-453D-9F2E-2DE81CB15E1E@gmail.com> <4F74C651-0B0B-4ECC-B9DA-A03221E62713@gmail.com> Message-ID: <39CAB164-5990-465F-9671-1677DD2FB85A@clemson.edu> Chris, Talke what you can get and don't kill yourself to get it. Dichromate when brushed on or spread with a roller is a fairly safe way of working. Spraying on a dichromated colloid emulsion with a spray gun or air brush is just plain stupid and dangerous. I looked into this for sensitizing carbon tissue and decided that the risks are just too great. so many ways to f&*k up and you never know which one is coming up next Don't do it. You have a better chance of lving a long life by shooting nudes in the state parks in Tennessee.. Sandy On Jul 2, 2013, at 11:12 AM, Christina Anderson wrote: > Marek, > > I loved seeing you work and talk! It is how I remember your personality when I first met you at Clay Harmon's years ago. > > That image, BTW, is gorgeous. I hope you put it on Flicker or something when it is done. You do really well with flowers, but that one particularly well in its gangliness and how you have framed it. > > I see that you brush first and then roller. That is interesting. You also brush and roller very gently. > > I am always amazed at how different people coat paper. I remember a couple scenarios: a student who was like attacking the paper with the brush and I had to tell her whoooooaaa.... > > Then Livick's use of the air spray gun and Judy Siegel's cautions still ringing in my ear about airborne dichromate. I have been very tempted, actually, to buy an air gun and test it out and still wonder if her cautions are overblown. Anyone know if Livick is still alive? I heard he quit gum. > > I always preferred the hake brush because of the borders, but now I mat out my borders so that would not matter anymore. My problem with the roller has been the streaks that have been left behind in the way I use it, streaks that come from the side of the roller and look very interruptive. I noticed when I rollered over and over and finer and finer the streaks disappeared, and with large works I bet a roller is the way to go, but for me and small works a damp hake followed by a dry hake do it all. > > There is a difference for me between brushing gum and brushing casein, too. I brush far longer with casein and far more vigorously. It doesn't get "sticky" like gum does...gum at a certain point gets tacky and you know it's getting time to quit brushing. Casein gets grabby. I can't quite describe it well but if I don't have the brush marks out of a casein print at a certain point it is no go after that. I also go through many brushes in a day. I will do a set of 4-8 casein prints using one wet brush and several dry, then while those are soaking I will do another layer on another set. By the end of the day I can have 20 hake brushes drying! Luckily the ones I use are cheap and they last for years. > > Chris > > > Christina Z. Anderson > christinaZanderson.com > > On Jun 22, 2013, at 1:08 PM, Marek Matusz wrote: > >> >> >> While I was coating my yellow gum layer today I remembered that Chris mentioned that she has no luck using rollers. SO I filmed it and here it is. My way of coating with rollers. I know that many on the list are using foam rollers and there is nothing new here, but maybe somebody can learn.It was fun making the video, now to exposing and development.https://plus.google.com/photos/105732508998271877151/albums/5882305049320410433 Marek >> _______________________________________________ >> Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo > > _______________________________________________ > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo From samwang864 at gmail.com Sat Jul 6 12:24:36 2013 From: samwang864 at gmail.com (sam wang) Date: Sat, 6 Jul 2013 08:24:36 -0400 Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: Gum coating video In-Reply-To: <39CAB164-5990-465F-9671-1677DD2FB85A@clemson.edu> References: , , <13E40A95-AB58-44E2-BFAB-6AC9CE966C3C@clemson.edu>, , <5883FBF6-383F-4541-85A0-713123F78743@gmail.com>, <6CE1ED4DD0E94DC4B223D9F411814597@FireBreather>, , <010101ce6ecf$55f6db10$01e49130$@net>, , , <0AD0D39F-B0E4-421D-A802-518DF67ECDE4@gmail.com>, , <668E39D4-B500-453D-9F2E-2DE81CB15E1E@gmail.com> <4F74C651-0B0B-4ECC-B9DA-A03221E62713@gmail.com> <39CAB164-5990-465F-9671-1677DD2FB85A@clemson.edu> Message-ID: Sandy, You are probably right about not spraying dichromated colloid. However, there is a very safe way to do it. First you brush on just the dichromate. Let it dry. Then spray or airbrush on the pigmented colloid. It's probably still necessary to take precautions and not breathe in any of the pigmented dust, but it's a lot easier to manage than having dichromate flying around. One really good part of doing it this way is that coating can be very thin, varied in color, and done leisurely. The coated area that will be light sensitive was determined by the brushed on dichromate. This is the way to do very delicate gum or casein, and get multiple colors in one shot. Shooting nudes in state parks in Tennessee is probably as unwise as bringing a 20x24 camera out into the woods with a 6 thousand dollar lens with a non-removable lens cap. Sam On Jul 6, 2013, at 1:17 AM, Sandy King wrote: > > > Chris, > > Talke what you can get and don't kill yourself to get it. Dichromate when brushed on or spread with a roller is a fairly safe way of working. Spraying on a dichromated colloid emulsion with a spray gun or air brush is just plain stupid and dangerous. I looked into this for sensitizing carbon tissue and decided that the risks are just too great. so many ways to f&*k up and you never know which one is coming up next > > Don't do it. You have a better chance of lving a long life by shooting nudes in the state parks in Tennessee.. > > Sandy > From sanking at clemson.edu Sat Jul 6 16:17:43 2013 From: sanking at clemson.edu (Sandy King) Date: Sat, 6 Jul 2013 12:17:43 -0400 Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: Gum coating video In-Reply-To: References: , , <13E40A95-AB58-44E2-BFAB-6AC9CE966C3C@clemson.edu>, , <5883FBF6-383F-4541-85A0-713123F78743@gmail.com>, <6CE1ED4DD0E94DC4B223D9F411814597@FireBreather>, , <010101ce6ecf$55f6db10$01e49130$@net>, , , <0AD0D39F-B0E4-421D-A802-518DF67ECDE4@gmail.com>, , <668E39D4-B500-453D-9F2E-2DE81CB15E1E@gmail.com> <4F74C651-0B0B-4ECC-B9DA-A03221E62713@gmail.com> <39CAB164-5990-465F-9671-1677DD2FB85A@clemson.edu> Message-ID: Sam, The hnon-removable lens cap gives big savings in cost of film. Sandy On Jul 6, 2013, at 8:24 AM, sam wang wrote: > Sandy, > > You are probably right about not spraying dichromated colloid. However, there is a very safe way to do it. First you brush on just the dichromate. Let it dry. Then spray or airbrush on the pigmented colloid. It's probably still necessary to take precautions and not breathe in any of the pigmented dust, but it's a lot easier to manage than having dichromate flying around. > > One really good part of doing it this way is that coating can be very thin, varied in color, and done leisurely. The coated area that will be light sensitive was determined by the brushed on dichromate. This is the way to do very delicate gum or casein, and get multiple colors in one shot. > > Shooting nudes in state parks in Tennessee is probably as unwise as bringing a 20x24 camera out into the woods with a 6 thousand dollar lens with a non-removable lens cap. > > Sam > > > On Jul 6, 2013, at 1:17 AM, Sandy King wrote: > >> >> >> Chris, >> >> Talke what you can get and don't kill yourself to get it. Dichromate when brushed on or spread with a roller is a fairly safe way of working. Spraying on a dichromated colloid emulsion with a spray gun or air brush is just plain stupid and dangerous. I looked into this for sensitizing carbon tissue and decided that the risks are just too great. so many ways to f&*k up and you never know which one is coming up next >> >> Don't do it. You have a better chance of lving a long life by shooting nudes in the state parks in Tennessee.. >> >> Sandy >> > > _______________________________________________ > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo From samwang864 at gmail.com Sat Jul 6 21:46:49 2013 From: samwang864 at gmail.com (sam wang) Date: Sat, 6 Jul 2013 17:46:49 -0400 Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: Gum coating video In-Reply-To: References: , , <13E40A95-AB58-44E2-BFAB-6AC9CE966C3C@clemson.edu>, , <5883FBF6-383F-4541-85A0-713123F78743@gmail.com>, <6CE1ED4DD0E94DC4B223D9F411814597@FireBreather>, , <010101ce6ecf$55f6db10$01e49130$@net>, , , <0AD0D39F-B0E4-421D-A802-518DF67ECDE4@gmail.com>, , <668E39D4-B500-453D-9F2E-2DE81CB15E1E@gmail.com> <4F74C651-0B0B-4ECC-B9DA-A03221E62713@gmail.com> <39CAB164-5990-465F-9671-1677DD2FB85A@clemson.edu> Message-ID: Plus all the expensive metals and paper and time you would have used to print those humongous negatives! It's yet another form of alt - air photography. Ultra green too. Sam On Jul 6, 2013, at 12:17 PM, Sandy King wrote: > Sam, > > The hnon-removable lens cap gives big savings in cost of film. > > > Sandy > > > On Jul 6, 2013, at 8:24 AM, sam wang wrote: > >> Sandy, >> >> You are probably right about not spraying dichromated colloid. However, there is a very safe way to do it. First you brush on just the dichromate. Let it dry. Then spray or airbrush on the pigmented colloid. It's probably still necessary to take precautions and not breathe in any of the pigmented dust, but it's a lot easier to manage than having dichromate flying around. >> >> One really good part of doing it this way is that coating can be very thin, varied in color, and done leisurely. The coated area that will be light sensitive was determined by the brushed on dichromate. This is the way to do very delicate gum or casein, and get multiple colors in one shot. >> >> Shooting nudes in state parks in Tennessee is probably as unwise as bringing a 20x24 camera out into the woods with a 6 thousand dollar lens with a non-removable lens cap. >> >> Sam >> >> >> On Jul 6, 2013, at 1:17 AM, Sandy King wrote: >> >>> >>> >>> Chris, >>> >>> Talke what you can get and don't kill yourself to get it. Dichromate when brushed on or spread with a roller is a fairly safe way of working. Spraying on a dichromated colloid emulsion with a spray gun or air brush is just plain stupid and dangerous. I looked into this for sensitizing carbon tissue and decided that the risks are just too great. so many ways to f&*k up and you never know which one is coming up next >>> >>> Don't do it. You have a better chance of lving a long life by shooting nudes in the state parks in Tennessee.. >>> >>> Sandy >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo > > _______________________________________________ > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo From tboley at tylerboley.com Sun Jul 7 04:16:33 2013 From: tboley at tylerboley.com (Tyler Boley) Date: Sat, 06 Jul 2013 21:16:33 -0700 Subject: [Alt-photo] one day print workshop Message-ID: <51D8EBA1.7040502@tylerboley.com> Ron Reeder and I will jointly give a one day class about a variety of print methods. I am primarily an inkjet guy, but Ron is a platinum palladium expert and makes digital negs, so I hope this is relevant on this list- http://www.custom-digital.com/2013/07/workshop-a-day-with-two-expert-printers/ Thanks, Tyler From mail at loris.medici.name Sun Jul 7 10:15:28 2013 From: mail at loris.medici.name (Loris Medici) Date: Sun, 7 Jul 2013 13:15:28 +0300 Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: Gum coating video In-Reply-To: References: <13E40A95-AB58-44E2-BFAB-6AC9CE966C3C@clemson.edu> <5883FBF6-383F-4541-85A0-713123F78743@gmail.com> <6CE1ED4DD0E94DC4B223D9F411814597@FireBreather> <010101ce6ecf$55f6db10$01e49130$@net> <0AD0D39F-B0E4-421D-A802-518DF67ECDE4@gmail.com> <668E39D4-B500-453D-9F2E-2DE81CB15E1E@gmail.com> Message-ID: Hi Marek, Just had time to watch the video (we're in the middle of switching to SAP ERP and it has been one week since we're in the production system - a real nightmare!!!), thank you very much; it was really helpful to me: I noticed that the viscosity of your gum solution is much lower than what I use, mine is considerably thicker than yours. Will try with more dilute coating solutions, the foam roller haven't worked for me in the past... (Probably because of thicker coating solution + I couldn't manage to find the similar - dense - kind foam roller you seem to be using.) Regards, Loris. 2013/6/22 Marek Matusz > > > While I was coating my yellow gum layer today I remembered that Chris > mentioned that she has no luck using rollers. SO I filmed it and here it > is. My way of coating with rollers. I know that many on the list are using > foam rollers and there is nothing new here, but maybe somebody can learn.It > was fun making the video, now to exposing and development. > https://plus.google.com/photos/105732508998271877151/albums/5882305049320410433Marek > _______________________________________________ > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo > From blackburnap at hotmail.com Mon Jul 8 15:23:40 2013 From: blackburnap at hotmail.com (Peter Blackburn) Date: Mon, 8 Jul 2013 10:23:40 -0500 Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: Gum coating video and Livick, too! In-Reply-To: <4F74C651-0B0B-4ECC-B9DA-A03221E62713@gmail.com> References: , , , , <13E40A95-AB58-44E2-BFAB-6AC9CE966C3C@clemson.edu>, , , , <5883FBF6-383F-4541-85A0-713123F78743@gmail.com>, , <6CE1ED4DD0E94DC4B223D9F411814597@FireBreather>, , , , <010101ce6ecf$55f6db10$01e49130$@net>, , , , , , <0AD0D39F-B0E4-421D-A802-518DF67ECDE4@gmail.com>, , , , <668E39D4-B500-453D-9F2E-2DE81CB15E1E@gmail.com>, , <4F74C651-0B0B-4ECC-B9DA-A03221E62713@gmail.com> Message-ID: Hi Christina and all: Yes, I can tell you most definitely that Stephen Livick has retired from gum? did so around 2005. I purchased a large chunk of his remaining tricolor pigments (Linel watercolors) when he hung up his gum printing hat to pursue digital endeavors. And, he is still very much alive, too. According to his recent July 3 online diary entry, he's been shooting with a Hasselblad H1. Considering his accomplishments with gum printing, produced almost entirely through analog technology (the exception being the last few years of his work) I consider him among the best gum printers to have ever walked the planet. My contacts with him through the years have always been cordial and helpful. Glad you asked. And it has been good to read all of the gum and casein discussion here lately, too! Peter J. Blackburn > From: christinazanderson at gmail.com > Date: Tue, 2 Jul 2013 09:12:35 -0600 > To: alt-photo-process-list at lists.altphotolist.org > Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: Gum coating video > > Marek, > > I loved seeing you work and talk! It is how I remember your personality when I first met you at Clay Harmon's years ago. > > That image, BTW, is gorgeous. I hope you put it on Flicker or something when it is done. You do really well with flowers, but that one particularly well in its gangliness and how you have framed it. > > I see that you brush first and then roller. That is interesting. You also brush and roller very gently. > > I am always amazed at how different people coat paper. I remember a couple scenarios: a student who was like attacking the paper with the brush and I had to tell her whoooooaaa.... > > Then Livick's use of the air spray gun and Judy Siegel's cautions still ringing in my ear about airborne dichromate. I have been very tempted, actually, to buy an air gun and test it out and still wonder if her cautions are overblown. Anyone know if Livick is still alive? I heard he quit gum. > > I always preferred the hake brush because of the borders, but now I mat out my borders so that would not matter anymore. My problem with the roller has been the streaks that have been left behind in the way I use it, streaks that come from the side of the roller and look very interruptive. I noticed when I rollered over and over and finer and finer the streaks disappeared, and with large works I bet a roller is the way to go, but for me and small works a damp hake followed by a dry hake do it all. > > There is a difference for me between brushing gum and brushing casein, too. I brush far longer with casein and far more vigorously. It doesn't get "sticky" like gum does...gum at a certain point gets tacky and you know it's getting time to quit brushing. Casein gets grabby. I can't quite describe it well but if I don't have the brush marks out of a casein print at a certain point it is no go after that. I also go through many brushes in a day. I will do a set of 4-8 casein prints using one wet brush and several dry, then while those are soaking I will do another layer on another set. By the end of the day I can have 20 hake brushes drying! Luckily the ones I use are cheap and they last for years. > > Chris > > > Christina Z. Anderson > christinaZanderson.com > > On Jun 22, 2013, at 1:08 PM, Marek Matusz wrote: > > > > > > > While I was coating my yellow gum layer today I remembered that Chris mentioned that she has no luck using rollers. SO I filmed it and here it is. My way of coating with rollers. I know that many on the list are using foam rollers and there is nothing new here, but maybe somebody can learn.It was fun making the video, now to exposing and development.https://plus.google.com/photos/105732508998271877151/albums/5882305049320410433 Marek > > _______________________________________________ > > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo > > _______________________________________________ > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo From stellaps at cableone.net Tue Jul 9 02:14:00 2013 From: stellaps at cableone.net (Stella Schneider) Date: Mon, 8 Jul 2013 20:14:00 -0600 Subject: [Alt-photo] Yupo question In-Reply-To: References: , , , , <13E40A95-AB58-44E2-BFAB-6AC9CE966C3C@clemson.edu>, , , , <5883FBF6-383F-4541-85A0-713123F78743@gmail.com>, , <6CE1ED4DD0E94DC4B223D9F411814597@FireBreather>, , , , <010101ce6ecf$55f6db10$01e49130$@net>, , , , , , <0AD0D39F-B0E4-421D-A802-518DF67ECDE4@gmail.com>, , , , <668E39D4-B500-453D-9F2E-2DE81CB15E1E@gmail.com>, , <4F74C651-0B0B-4ECC-B9DA-A03221E62713@gmail.com> Message-ID: <001801ce7c49$fb679710$f236c530$@net> I have seen several people on this list show their gorgeous gum prints on Yupo. I have tried it every way from Sunday and get nothing but roll-off. Could someone give me some pointers? Gelatin, PVA, plain? Please and thank you. Stella From sanking at clemson.edu Tue Jul 9 03:24:31 2013 From: sanking at clemson.edu (Sandy King) Date: Mon, 8 Jul 2013 23:24:31 -0400 Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: 100% Rag Similar to Canson Montval In-Reply-To: <001801ce7c49$fb679710$f236c530$@net> References: , , , , <13E40A95-AB58-44E2-BFAB-6AC9CE966C3C@clemson.edu>, , , , <5883FBF6-383F-4541-85A0-713123F78743@gmail.com>, , <6CE1ED4DD0E94DC4B223D9F411814597@FireBreather>, , , , <010101ce6ecf$55f6db10$01e49130$@net>, , , , , , <0AD0D39F-B0E4-421D-A802-518DF67ECDE4@gmail.com>, , , , <668E39D4-B500-453D-9F2E-2DE81CB15E1E@gmail.com>, , <4F74C651-0B0B-4ECC-B9DA-A03221E62713@gmail.com> <001801ce7c49$fb679710$f236c530$@net> Message-ID: Hello, I sometimes print in carbon transfer with 140 lb Canson Montval, after applying a layer of gelatin. I like the hard and pebbly surface. Can any of you gum printers recommend a 100% cotton rag paper with a similar surface? Sandy From mail at loris.medici.name Tue Jul 9 09:51:53 2013 From: mail at loris.medici.name (Loris Medici) Date: Tue, 9 Jul 2013 12:51:53 +0300 Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: 100% Rag Similar to Canson Montval In-Reply-To: References: <13E40A95-AB58-44E2-BFAB-6AC9CE966C3C@clemson.edu> <5883FBF6-383F-4541-85A0-713123F78743@gmail.com> <6CE1ED4DD0E94DC4B223D9F411814597@FireBreather> <010101ce6ecf$55f6db10$01e49130$@net> <0AD0D39F-B0E4-421D-A802-518DF67ECDE4@gmail.com> <668E39D4-B500-453D-9F2E-2DE81CB15E1E@gmail.com> <4F74C651-0B0B-4ECC-B9DA-A03221E62713@gmail.com> <001801ce7c49$fb679710$f236c530$@net> Message-ID: Hi Sandy, Have you tried Fabriano Artistico Extra White Soft Press? Not exactly Montval texture; it's slightly more uniform and and less pronounced but the surface is very hard. Regards, Loris. 2013/7/9 Sandy King > Hello, > > > I sometimes print in carbon transfer with 140 lb Canson Montval, after > applying a layer of gelatin. I like the hard and pebbly surface. Can any of > you gum printers recommend a 100% cotton rag paper with a similar surface? > > Sandy > _______________________________________________ > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo > From blackburnap at hotmail.com Tue Jul 9 12:07:50 2013 From: blackburnap at hotmail.com (Peter Blackburn) Date: Tue, 9 Jul 2013 07:07:50 -0500 Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: 100% Rag Similar to Canson Montval In-Reply-To: References: , ,,, ,,<13E40A95-AB58-44E2-BFAB-6AC9CE966C3C@clemson.edu>, , , , , , <5883FBF6-383F-4541-85A0-713123F78743@gmail.com>, ,,<6CE1ED4DD0E94DC4B223D9F411814597@FireBreather>, ,,, ,,<010101ce6ecf$55f6db10$01e49130$@net>, ,,, ,,, ,,<0AD0D39F-B0E4-421D-A802-518DF67ECDE4@gmail.com>, ,,, , , <668E39D4-B500-453D-9F2E-2DE81CB15E1E@gmail.com>, , , , <4F74C651-0B0B-4ECC-B9DA-A03221E62713@gmail.com>, , <001801ce7c49$fb679710$f236c530$@net>, Message-ID: Hi Sandy: You might give Strathmore Imperial a try. Cheap Joe's is one readily available source for that particular paper. All the best! Peter J. Blackburn > From: sanking at clemson.edu > Date: Mon, 8 Jul 2013 23:24:31 -0400 > To: alt-photo-process-list at lists.altphotolist.org > Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: 100% Rag Similar to Canson Montval > > Hello, > > > I sometimes print in carbon transfer with 140 lb Canson Montval, after applying a layer of gelatin. I like the hard and pebbly surface. Can any of you gum printers recommend a 100% cotton rag paper with a similar surface? > > Sandy > _______________________________________________ > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo From tboley at tylerboley.com Tue Jul 9 17:47:04 2013 From: tboley at tylerboley.com (Tyler Boley) Date: Tue, 09 Jul 2013 10:47:04 -0700 Subject: [Alt-photo] Kallitype stain Message-ID: <51DC4C98.6070303@tylerboley.com> I posted this at DPUG.org, but I figured the more answers the better... I see this is an issue here, but mine is not with ongoing work and processing I can alter to solve. I got out a kallitype I made in 1985. It's been out of the light all these years. I'm seeing the yellow stain where the emulsion was brushed on, but neg masked off for white edge, so easy to see. I take it this is a clearing problem, either iron or silver? My question is, can I treat it in anything now to clear the stain? Thank you, Tyler From donsbryant at gmail.com Tue Jul 9 18:13:49 2013 From: donsbryant at gmail.com (Don Bryant) Date: Tue, 9 Jul 2013 14:13:49 -0400 Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: Kallitype stain In-Reply-To: <51DC4C98.6070303@tylerboley.com> References: <51DC4C98.6070303@tylerboley.com> Message-ID: Practically speaking, NO, IMHE. Removal of ferric salts after the fact is typically regarded as impossible. However, if you submit your print to the waves (as Judy Seigel used to remark) be prepared to loose the whole thing. If you want to take the risk, try a 1% solution of HCL. Don Bryant On Tue, Jul 9, 2013 at 1:47 PM, Tyler Boley wrote: > I posted this at DPUG.org, but I figured the more answers the better... > > I see this is an issue here, but mine is not with ongoing work and > processing I can alter to solve. I got out a kallitype I made in 1985. It's > been out of the light all these years. I'm seeing the yellow stain where > the emulsion was brushed on, but neg masked off for white edge, so easy to > see. I take it this is a clearing problem, either iron or silver? My > question is, can I treat it in anything now to clear the stain? > Thank you, > Tyler > ______________________________**_________________ > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/**mailman/listinfo > From marekmatusz at hotmail.com Wed Jul 10 13:57:13 2013 From: marekmatusz at hotmail.com (Marek Matusz) Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2013 08:57:13 -0500 Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: Yupo question In-Reply-To: <001801ce7c49$fb679710$f236c530$@net> References: <13E40A95-AB58-44E2-BFAB-6AC9CE966C3C@clemson.edu> <5883FBF6-383F-4541-85A0-713123F78743@gmail.com> <6CE1ED4DD0E94DC4B223D9F411814597@FireBreather> <010101ce6ecf$55f6db10$01e49130$@net> <0AD0D39F-B0E4-421D-A802-518DF67ECDE4@gmail.com> <668E39D4-B500-453D-9F2E-2DE81CB15E1E@gmail.com> <4F74C651-0B0B-4ECC-B9DA-A03221E62713@gmail.com> <001801ce7c49$fb679710$f236c530$@net> Message-ID: Stella. While coating yupo is certainly a possibility and should help I have made good looking prints on straight yupo. The trick is to coat a very very thin gum layer. In practical terms you will need to dilute your mix with water. Also since yupo is non absorbent you will need much less solution to coat when compared with paper. Marek Sent from my iPhone On Jul 8, 2013, at 9:14 PM, "Stella Schneider" wrote: > I have seen several people on this list show their gorgeous gum prints on > Yupo. I have tried it every way from Sunday and get nothing but roll-off. > Could someone give me some pointers? Gelatin, PVA, plain? Please and thank > you. > Stella > > _______________________________________________ > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo From stellaps at cableone.net Wed Jul 10 18:53:27 2013 From: stellaps at cableone.net (Stella Schneider) Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2013 12:53:27 -0600 Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: Yupo question In-Reply-To: References: <13E40A95-AB58-44E2-BFAB-6AC9CE966C3C@clemson.edu> <5883FBF6-383F-4541-85A0-713123F78743@gmail.com> <6CE1ED4DD0E94DC4B223D9F411814597@FireBreather> <010101ce6ecf$55f6db10$01e49130$@net> <0AD0D39F-B0E4-421D-A802-518DF67ECDE4@gmail.com> <668E39D4-B500-453D-9F2E-2DE81CB15E1E@gmail.com> <4F74C651-0B0B-4ECC-B9DA-A03221E62713@gmail.com> <001801ce7c49$fb679710$f236c530$@net> Message-ID: <003101ce7d9e$c4482410$4cd86c30$@net> Thanks much, Marek. I'll try again. Stella -----Original Message----- From: alt-photo-process-list-bounces at lists.altphotolist.org [mailto:alt-photo-process-list-bounces at lists.altphotolist.org] On Behalf Of Marek Matusz Sent: Wednesday, July 10, 2013 7:57 AM To: alt-photo-process-list at lists.altphotolist.org Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: Yupo question Stella. While coating yupo is certainly a possibility and should help I have made good looking prints on straight yupo. The trick is to coat a very very thin gum layer. In practical terms you will need to dilute your mix with water. Also since yupo is non absorbent you will need much less solution to coat when compared with paper. Marek Sent from my iPhone On Jul 8, 2013, at 9:14 PM, "Stella Schneider" wrote: > I have seen several people on this list show their gorgeous gum prints > on Yupo. I have tried it every way from Sunday and get nothing but roll-off. > Could someone give me some pointers? Gelatin, PVA, plain? Please and > thank you. > Stella > > _______________________________________________ > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo _______________________________________________ Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo From gneissgirl at spamcop.net Wed Jul 10 20:56:42 2013 From: gneissgirl at spamcop.net (Mary Donato) Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2013 14:56:42 -0600 Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: Yupo question In-Reply-To: <003101ce7d9e$c4482410$4cd86c30$@net> References: <13E40A95-AB58-44E2-BFAB-6AC9CE966C3C@clemson.edu> <5883FBF6-383F-4541-85A0-713123F78743@gmail.com> <6CE1ED4DD0E94DC4B223D9F411814597@FireBreather> <010101ce6ecf$55f6db10$01e49130$@net> <0AD0D39F-B0E4-421D-A802-518DF67ECDE4@gmail.com> <668E39D4-B500-453D-9F2E-2DE81CB15E1E@gmail.com> <4F74C651-0B0B-4ECC-B9DA-A03221E62713@gmail.com> <001801ce7c49$fb679710$f236c530$@net> <003101ce7d9e$c4482410$4cd86c30$@net> Message-ID: <818A3D63-AEBE-4528-84D0-457A73194090@spamcop.net> Hi Stella, I wonder if light sanding with very fine sandpaper (e.g. 1000 grit) would give the Yupo a little tooth. Have you tried that sort of thing? Good luck, and let us know how it goes. Cheers, Mary ~~~~~ www.alternative-ego.com On Jul 10, 2013, at 12:53 PM, "Stella Schneider" wrote: > Thanks much, Marek. I'll try again. > Stella > > -----Original Message----- > From: alt-photo-process-list-bounces at lists.altphotolist.org > [mailto:alt-photo-process-list-bounces at lists.altphotolist.org] On Behalf Of > Marek Matusz > Sent: Wednesday, July 10, 2013 7:57 AM > To: alt-photo-process-list at lists.altphotolist.org > Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: Yupo question > > Stella. > While coating yupo is certainly a possibility and should help I have made > good looking prints on straight yupo. The trick is to coat a very very thin > gum layer. In practical terms you will need to dilute your mix with water. > Also since yupo is non absorbent you will need much less solution to coat > when compared with paper. > > Marek > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Jul 8, 2013, at 9:14 PM, "Stella Schneider" > wrote: > >> I have seen several people on this list show their gorgeous gum prints >> on Yupo. I have tried it every way from Sunday and get nothing but > roll-off. >> Could someone give me some pointers? Gelatin, PVA, plain? Please and >> thank you. >> Stella >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo > _______________________________________________ > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo > > _______________________________________________ > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo From gneissgirl at spamcop.net Wed Jul 10 20:56:42 2013 From: gneissgirl at spamcop.net (Mary Donato) Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2013 14:56:42 -0600 Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: Yupo question In-Reply-To: <003101ce7d9e$c4482410$4cd86c30$@net> References: <13E40A95-AB58-44E2-BFAB-6AC9CE966C3C@clemson.edu> <5883FBF6-383F-4541-85A0-713123F78743@gmail.com> <6CE1ED4DD0E94DC4B223D9F411814597@FireBreather> <010101ce6ecf$55f6db10$01e49130$@net> <0AD0D39F-B0E4-421D-A802-518DF67ECDE4@gmail.com> <668E39D4-B500-453D-9F2E-2DE81CB15E1E@gmail.com> <4F74C651-0B0B-4ECC-B9DA-A03221E62713@gmail.com> <001801ce7c49$fb679710$f236c530$@net> <003101ce7d9e$c4482410$4cd86c30$@net> Message-ID: <818A3D63-AEBE-4528-84D0-457A73194090@spamcop.net> Hi Stella, I wonder if light sanding with very fine sandpaper (e.g. 1000 grit) would give the Yupo a little tooth. Have you tried that sort of thing? Good luck, and let us know how it goes. Cheers, Mary ~~~~~ www.alternative-ego.com On Jul 10, 2013, at 12:53 PM, "Stella Schneider" wrote: > Thanks much, Marek. I'll try again. > Stella > > -----Original Message----- > From: alt-photo-process-list-bounces at lists.altphotolist.org > [mailto:alt-photo-process-list-bounces at lists.altphotolist.org] On Behalf Of > Marek Matusz > Sent: Wednesday, July 10, 2013 7:57 AM > To: alt-photo-process-list at lists.altphotolist.org > Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: Yupo question > > Stella. > While coating yupo is certainly a possibility and should help I have made > good looking prints on straight yupo. The trick is to coat a very very thin > gum layer. In practical terms you will need to dilute your mix with water. > Also since yupo is non absorbent you will need much less solution to coat > when compared with paper. > > Marek > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Jul 8, 2013, at 9:14 PM, "Stella Schneider" > wrote: > >> I have seen several people on this list show their gorgeous gum prints >> on Yupo. I have tried it every way from Sunday and get nothing but > roll-off. >> Could someone give me some pointers? Gelatin, PVA, plain? Please and >> thank you. >> Stella >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo > _______________________________________________ > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo > > _______________________________________________ > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo From sanking at clemson.edu Wed Jul 10 23:52:28 2013 From: sanking at clemson.edu (Sandy King) Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2013 19:52:28 -0400 Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: Yupo question In-Reply-To: <818A3D63-AEBE-4528-84D0-457A73194090@spamcop.net> References: <13E40A95-AB58-44E2-BFAB-6AC9CE966C3C@clemson.edu> <5883FBF6-383F-4541-85A0-713123F78743@gmail.com> <6CE1ED4DD0E94DC4B223D9F411814597@FireBreather> <010101ce6ecf$55f6db10$01e49130$@net> <0AD0D39F-B0E4-421D-A802-518DF67ECDE4@gmail.com> <668E39D4-B500-453D-9F2E-2DE81CB15E1E@gmail.com> <4F74C651-0B0B-4ECC-B9DA-A03221E62713@gmail.com> <001801ce7c49$fb679710$f236c530$@net> <003101ce7d9e$c4482410$4cd86c30$@net> <818A3D63-AEBE-4528! -84D0-457A73194090@spamcop.net> Message-ID: Hi Stella, Some carbon printers have encountered problems (bubbles, image lifting) in developing images on Yupo out of the box. In many cases the problem has been solved by cleaning the paper before use with a mild detergent, or with a water solution containing a bit of isopropyl. There is some indication that Yupo out of the box may have some type of thin industrial waste coating that interferes with adhesion with colloid type reliefs. Sandy On Jul 10, 2013, at 4:56 PM, Mary Donato wrote: > Hi Stella, > > I wonder if light sanding with very fine sandpaper (e.g. 1000 grit) would give the Yupo a little tooth. Have you tried that sort of thing? > Good luck, and let us know how it goes. > > Cheers, > Mary > > ~~~~~ > www.alternative-ego.com > > > On Jul 10, 2013, at 12:53 PM, "Stella Schneider" wrote: > >> Thanks much, Marek. I'll try again. >> Stella >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: alt-photo-process-list-bounces at lists.altphotolist.org >> [mailto:alt-photo-process-list-bounces at lists.altphotolist.org] On Behalf Of >> Marek Matusz >> Sent: Wednesday, July 10, 2013 7:57 AM >> To: alt-photo-process-list at lists.altphotolist.org >> Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: Yupo question >> >> Stella. >> While coating yupo is certainly a possibility and should help I have made >> good looking prints on straight yupo. The trick is to coat a very very thin >> gum layer. In practical terms you will need to dilute your mix with water. >> Also since yupo is non absorbent you will need much less solution to coat >> when compared with paper. >> >> Marek >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On Jul 8, 2013, at 9:14 PM, "Stella Schneider" >> wrote: >> >>> I have seen several people on this list show their gorgeous gum prints >>> on Yupo. I have tried it every way from Sunday and get nothing but >> roll-off. >>> Could someone give me some pointers? Gelatin, PVA, plain? Please and >>> thank you. >>> Stella >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo >> _______________________________________________ >> Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo > _______________________________________________ > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo From marekmatusz at hotmail.com Thu Jul 11 02:25:46 2013 From: marekmatusz at hotmail.com (Marek Matusz) Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2013 02:25:46 +0000 Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: Yupo question In-Reply-To: <003101ce7d9e$c4482410$4cd86c30$@net> References: , , <13E40A95-AB58-44E2-BFAB-6AC9CE966C3C@clemson.edu>, , <5883FBF6-383F-4541-85A0-713123F78743@gmail.com>, <6CE1ED4DD0E94DC4B223D9F411814597@FireBreather>, , <010101ce6ecf$55f6db10$01e49130$@net>, , , <0AD0D39F-B0E4-421D-A802-518DF67ECDE4@gmail.com>, , <668E39D4-B500-453D-9F2E-2DE81CB15E1E@gmail.com>, , <4F74C651-0B0B-4ECC-B9DA-A03221E62713@gmail.com>, , <001801ce7c49$fb679710$f236c530$@net>, , <003101ce7d9e$c4482410$4cd86c30$@net> Message-ID: Stella, I think that roughening of the yupo surface is a good idea. Just cleaning it with some kitchen cleaning powder should perhaps be good for noth roughening the surface and cleaning it. Wash it and dry without touching. In terms of coating you should watch the video that I posted. Spread some gum solution with a brush and then smooth it out with a foam roller. You can take away some coating by rolling the roller on a dry paper towel and on the coated yupo in turns. You can not get layer thin enough just by brushing IMO. Lets us know how it works. Marek > From: stellaps at cableone.net > To: alt-photo-process-list at lists.altphotolist.org > Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2013 12:53:27 -0600 > Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: Yupo question > > Thanks much, Marek. I'll try again. > Stella > > -----Original Message----- > From: alt-photo-process-list-bounces at lists.altphotolist.org > [mailto:alt-photo-process-list-bounces at lists.altphotolist.org] On Behalf Of > Marek Matusz > Sent: Wednesday, July 10, 2013 7:57 AM > To: alt-photo-process-list at lists.altphotolist.org > Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: Yupo question > > Stella. > While coating yupo is certainly a possibility and should help I have made > good looking prints on straight yupo. The trick is to coat a very very thin > gum layer. In practical terms you will need to dilute your mix with water. > Also since yupo is non absorbent you will need much less solution to coat > when compared with paper. > > Marek > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Jul 8, 2013, at 9:14 PM, "Stella Schneider" > wrote: > > > I have seen several people on this list show their gorgeous gum prints > > on Yupo. I have tried it every way from Sunday and get nothing but > roll-off. > > Could someone give me some pointers? Gelatin, PVA, plain? Please and > > thank you. > > Stella > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo > _______________________________________________ > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo > > _______________________________________________ > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo From emanphoto at gmail.com Thu Jul 11 04:34:05 2013 From: emanphoto at gmail.com (eric nelson) Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2013 11:34:05 +0700 Subject: [Alt-photo] The Big Fat List of Documentaries About Photography Message-ID: http://erikagentry.com/2013/07/10/the-big-fat-list-of-documentaries-about-photography/ -- Eric Nelson Photography 086 343 1612 http://ericnelsonphoto.tumblr.com/ https://www.facebook.com/EricNelsonPhotographyBangkok From geoff at geoffgallery.net Thu Jul 11 05:02:09 2013 From: geoff at geoffgallery.net (Geoff Chaplin) Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2013 14:02:09 +0900 Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: Yupo question In-Reply-To: References: , , <13E40A95-AB58-44E2-BFAB-6AC9CE966C3C@clemson.edu>, , <5883FBF6-383F-4541-85A0-713123F78743@gmail.com>, <6CE1ED4DD0E94DC4B223D9F411814597@FireBreather>, , <010101ce6ecf$55f6db10$01e49130$@net>, , , <0AD0D39F-B0E4-421D-A802-518DF67ECDE4@gmail.com>, , <668E39D4-B500-453D-9F2E-2DE81CB15E1E@gmail.com>, , <4F74C651-0B0B-4ECC-B9DA-A03221E62713@gmail.com>, , <001801ce7c49$fb679710$f236c530$@net>, , <003101ce7d9e$c4482410$4cd86c30$@net> Message-ID: <000a01ce7df3$cd125a20$67370e60$@geoffgallery.net> One think Alex Chater (co-developer of the temperaprint process) suggested to me was "difficult surface primer" which he said works well and passes the sellotape test. I haven' tried it yet but I have a mountain of Yupo and found I'm allergic to the smell of eggs (so no more tempera printing for me). Geoff Chaplin ?????????? geoff at geoffgallery.net www.geoffgallery.net Skype: geoffchaplin1611 UK mobile (???????): +44(0) 7770 787069 Japan mobile (???????): +81(0) 90 6440 7037 Japan land line / fax (??????????): +81(0) 166 92 5855 -----Original Message----- From: alt-photo-process-list-bounces at lists.altphotolist.org [mailto:alt-photo-process-list-bounces at lists.altphotolist.org] On Behalf Of Marek Matusz Sent: Thursday, July 11, 2013 11:26 AM To: alt photo Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: Yupo question Stella, I think that roughening of the yupo surface is a good idea. Just cleaning it with some kitchen cleaning powder should perhaps be good for noth roughening the surface and cleaning it. Wash it and dry without touching. In terms of coating you should watch the video that I posted. Spread some gum solution with a brush and then smooth it out with a foam roller. You can take away some coating by rolling the roller on a dry paper towel and on the coated yupo in turns. You can not get layer thin enough just by brushing IMO. Lets us know how it works. Marek > From: stellaps at cableone.net > To: alt-photo-process-list at lists.altphotolist.org > Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2013 12:53:27 -0600 > Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: Yupo question > > Thanks much, Marek. I'll try again. > Stella > > -----Original Message----- > From: alt-photo-process-list-bounces at lists.altphotolist.org > [mailto:alt-photo-process-list-bounces at lists.altphotolist.org] On > Behalf Of Marek Matusz > Sent: Wednesday, July 10, 2013 7:57 AM > To: alt-photo-process-list at lists.altphotolist.org > Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: Yupo question > > Stella. > While coating yupo is certainly a possibility and should help I have > made good looking prints on straight yupo. The trick is to coat a very > very thin gum layer. In practical terms you will need to dilute your mix with water. > Also since yupo is non absorbent you will need much less solution to > coat when compared with paper. > > Marek > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Jul 8, 2013, at 9:14 PM, "Stella Schneider" > wrote: > > > I have seen several people on this list show their gorgeous gum > > prints on Yupo. I have tried it every way from Sunday and get > > nothing but > roll-off. > > Could someone give me some pointers? Gelatin, PVA, plain? Please > > and thank you. > > Stella > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo > _______________________________________________ > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo > > _______________________________________________ > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo _______________________________________________ Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo From jean.daubas at wanadoo.fr Thu Jul 11 09:14:55 2013 From: jean.daubas at wanadoo.fr (Jean Daubas) Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2013 11:14:55 +0200 Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: The Big Fat List of Documentaries About Photography In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hi Eric, Thanks for this fantastic resource; I knew a lot of these movies but I am discovering some true gems! Some documentaries I know seem to be missing; do you think it would be interesting to contact Wirdjo Hardjono to add these references? Thanks again for sharing, alternative cheers from France, Jean From: eric nelson Sent: Thursday, July 11, 2013 6:34 AM To: alt-photo-process-list at lists.altphotolist.org Subject: [Alt-photo] The Big Fat List of Documentaries About Photography http://erikagentry.com/2013/07/10/the-big-fat-list-of-documentaries-about-photography/ From emanphoto at gmail.com Thu Jul 11 11:02:05 2013 From: emanphoto at gmail.com (eric nelson) Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2013 18:02:05 +0700 Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: The Big Fat List of Documentaries About Photography In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: You're quite welcome Jean. Cheers from Bangkok. e On Thu, Jul 11, 2013 at 4:14 PM, Jean Daubas wrote: > Hi Eric, > > Thanks for this fantastic resource; I knew a lot of these movies but I am > discovering some true gems! > Some documentaries I know seem to be missing; do you think it would be > interesting to contact Wirdjo Hardjono to add these references? > > Thanks again for sharing, > alternative cheers from France, > Jean > > > From: eric nelson > Sent: Thursday, July 11, 2013 6:34 AM > To: alt-photo-process-list at lists.altphotolist.org > Subject: [Alt-photo] The Big Fat List of Documentaries About Photography > > http://erikagentry.com/2013/07/10/the-big-fat-list-of-documentaries-about-photography/ > _______________________________________________ > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo > -- Eric Nelson Photography 086 343 1612 http://ericnelsonphoto.tumblr.com/ https://www.facebook.com/EricNelsonPhotographyBangkok From emanphoto at gmail.com Thu Jul 11 11:26:19 2013 From: emanphoto at gmail.com (eric nelson) Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2013 18:26:19 +0700 Subject: [Alt-photo] Food Grade Chemicals Message-ID: This is a cross post so sorry if you've getting it again. I've *finally* found ONE chemical supplier here that has some of the chemicals I need and use, but it turns out that they only supply "food grade" chemicals. Now this means that the prices can be cheap, which is good. While talking to them, I asked about their prices, which they don't list on their site. ( http://www.ucs1986.com/chemical.htm) They asked me which chems I wanted, so quickly scanning the list online I figured Sodium metabisulfite would give me a good benchmark as to their prices. 1 kilo is 82 THB which equals $2.63. Score! Umm, maybe! So my question is, how usable are food grade chemicals in photography? My guess is that with something like a metal salt (not sure what that would be doing in "food") in food grade might not be the best choice. This subject has been covered at length on this apug posting, but goes on ad nauseum ( http://www.apug.org/forums/forum37/61248-food-grade-chemistry-ok-use-photography.html) and I'm hoping for a more concise discussion from personal experiences or 2nd hand experiences even. :) e -- Eric Nelson Photography 086 343 1612 http://ericnelsonphoto.tumblr.com/ https://www.facebook.com/EricNelsonPhotographyBangkok From samwang864 at gmail.com Thu Jul 11 12:14:27 2013 From: samwang864 at gmail.com (sam wang) Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2013 08:14:27 -0400 Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: Food Grade Chemicals In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: The ferric ammonium citrate I received many years ago for cyanotype was food grade. I think as long as you can find it, food grade or not makes no difference. For many years casein was mainly available commercially as a food source, and smallest quantity you could buy was 50 lbs, at about $1/lb. Sam On Jul 11, 2013, at 7:26 AM, eric nelson wrote: > This is a cross post so sorry if you've getting it again. > > I've *finally* found ONE chemical supplier here that has some of the > chemicals I need and use, but it turns out that they only supply "food > grade" chemicals. > > Now this means that the prices can be cheap, which is good. While talking > to them, I asked about their prices, which they don't list on their site. ( > http://www.ucs1986.com/chemical.htm) They asked me which chems I wanted, > so quickly scanning the list online I figured Sodium metabisulfite would > give me a good benchmark as to their prices. 1 kilo is 82 THB which equals > $2.63. > > Score! > > Umm, maybe! > > So my question is, how usable are food grade chemicals in photography? My > guess is that with something like a metal salt (not sure what that would be > doing in "food") in food grade might not be the best choice. This subject > has been covered at length on this apug posting, but goes on ad nauseum ( > http://www.apug.org/forums/forum37/61248-food-grade-chemistry-ok-use-photography.html) > and I'm hoping for a more concise discussion from personal experiences or > 2nd hand experiences even. :) > > e > > -- > Eric Nelson Photography > 086 343 1612 > http://ericnelsonphoto.tumblr.com/ > https://www.facebook.com/EricNelsonPhotographyBangkok > _______________________________________________ > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo From mail at loris.medici.name Thu Jul 11 12:26:40 2013 From: mail at loris.medici.name (Loris Medici) Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2013 15:26:40 +0300 Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: Food Grade Chemicals In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <6065982603859794366@unknownmsgid> Hi Eric my gum arabic, sodium benzoate (for preservation of gum arabic solution), vitamin c (used in developer) and agar agar stocks are all food grade. When it comes to colloids food grade is the best - except for gelatin perhaps, photographic needs are stricter with gelatin... Regards, Loris. On 11 Tem 2013, at 14:26, eric nelson wrote: > This is a cross post so sorry if you've getting it again. > > I've *finally* found ONE chemical supplier here that has some of the > chemicals I need and use, but it turns out that they only supply "food > grade" chemicals. > > Now this means that the prices can be cheap, which is good. While talking > to them, I asked about their prices, which they don't list on their site. ( > http://www.ucs1986.com/chemical.htm) They asked me which chems I wanted, > so quickly scanning the list online I figured Sodium metabisulfite would > give me a good benchmark as to their prices. 1 kilo is 82 THB which equals > $2.63. > > Score! > > Umm, maybe! > > So my question is, how usable are food grade chemicals in photography? My > guess is that with something like a metal salt (not sure what that would be > doing in "food") in food grade might not be the best choice. This subject > has been covered at length on this apug posting, but goes on ad nauseum ( > http://www.apug.org/forums/forum37/61248-food-grade-chemistry-ok-use-photography.html) > and I'm hoping for a more concise discussion from personal experiences or > 2nd hand experiences even. :) > > e > > -- > Eric Nelson Photography > 086 343 1612 > http://ericnelsonphoto.tumblr.com/ > https://www.facebook.com/EricNelsonPhotographyBangkok > _______________________________________________ > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo From jefulton1 at comcast.net Thu Jul 11 14:12:57 2013 From: jefulton1 at comcast.net (Jack Fulton) Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2013 07:12:57 -0700 Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: Food Grade Chemicals In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <9B843CFD-7578-4470-8C53-72FA43EC9ED0@comcast.net> Not using as many chems as most of you, in my b/w work and out of sodium carbonate, I found it at a pool supply store and it worked fine . . later, comparing it with Kodak's product, which was in appearance much cleaner, I found no difference. Hence, like Sam, I found no difference but rather than simply switch to less costly source I'd think it to be wise to compare initially. Jack On Jul 11, 2013, at 5:14 AM, sam wang wrote: > The ferric ammonium citrate I received many years ago for cyanotype was food grade. I think as long as you can find it, food grade or not makes no difference. > > For many years casein was mainly available commercially as a food source, and smallest quantity you could buy was 50 lbs, at about $1/lb. > > Sam > > On Jul 11, 2013, at 7:26 AM, eric nelson wrote: > >> This is a cross post so sorry if you've getting it again. >> >> I've *finally* found ONE chemical supplier here that has some of the >> chemicals I need and use, but it turns out that they only supply "food >> grade" chemicals. >> >> Now this means that the prices can be cheap, which is good. While talking >> to them, I asked about their prices, which they don't list on their site. ( >> http://www.ucs1986.com/chemical.htm) They asked me which chems I wanted, >> so quickly scanning the list online I figured Sodium metabisulfite would >> give me a good benchmark as to their prices. 1 kilo is 82 THB which equals >> $2.63. >> >> Score! >> >> Umm, maybe! >> >> So my question is, how usable are food grade chemicals in photography? My >> guess is that with something like a metal salt (not sure what that would be >> doing in "food") in food grade might not be the best choice. This subject >> has been covered at length on this apug posting, but goes on ad nauseum ( >> http://www.apug.org/forums/forum37/61248-food-grade-chemistry-ok-use-photography.html) >> and I'm hoping for a more concise discussion from personal experiences or >> 2nd hand experiences even. :) >> >> e >> >> -- >> Eric Nelson Photography >> 086 343 1612 >> http://ericnelsonphoto.tumblr.com/ >> https://www.facebook.com/EricNelsonPhotographyBangkok >> _______________________________________________ >> Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo > > _______________________________________________ > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo From bobkiss at caribsurf.com Thu Jul 11 15:30:05 2013 From: bobkiss at caribsurf.com (BOB KISS) Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2013 11:30:05 -0400 Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: Food Grade Chemicals In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: DEAR ERIC, Many moons have passed, Kimosabe, since my father worked for Merck and Co...somewhere around the late 30s and then he was a pharmacist's mate on ships in the Merchant Marines during WW II. But he taught me at the very beginning of my photographic endeavors (around 12 years old) that Photographic Grade chemicals were well below Food Grade in purity and only slightly better than Technical Grade. Now this was half a century ago so I don't know if either the grading system has changed or my memory serves me properly. The only time I would truly care about better than food grade (Lab or Reagent grade) would be with very expensive metal salts (silver, gold, platinum, palladium) and other reagents in their respective processes. Other than that you should be fine. CHEERS! BOB -----Original Message----- From: alt-photo-process-list-bounces at lists.altphotolist.org [mailto:alt-photo-process-list-bounces at lists.altphotolist.org] On Behalf Of eric nelson Sent: Thursday, July 11, 2013 7:26 AM To: alt-photo-process-list at lists.altphotolist.org Subject: [Alt-photo] Food Grade Chemicals This is a cross post so sorry if you've getting it again. I've *finally* found ONE chemical supplier here that has some of the chemicals I need and use, but it turns out that they only supply "food grade" chemicals. Now this means that the prices can be cheap, which is good. While talking to them, I asked about their prices, which they don't list on their site. ( http://www.ucs1986.com/chemical.htm) They asked me which chems I wanted, so quickly scanning the list online I figured Sodium metabisulfite would give me a good benchmark as to their prices. 1 kilo is 82 THB which equals $2.63. Score! Umm, maybe! So my question is, how usable are food grade chemicals in photography? My guess is that with something like a metal salt (not sure what that would be doing in "food") in food grade might not be the best choice. This subject has been covered at length on this apug posting, but goes on ad nauseum ( http://www.apug.org/forums/forum37/61248-food-grade-chemistry-ok-use-photogr aphy.html) and I'm hoping for a more concise discussion from personal experiences or 2nd hand experiences even. :) e -- Eric Nelson Photography 086 343 1612 http://ericnelsonphoto.tumblr.com/ https://www.facebook.com/EricNelsonPhotographyBangkok _______________________________________________ Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo __________ Information from ESET Smart Security, version of virus signature database 8554 (20130711) __________ The message was checked by ESET Smart Security. http://www.eset.com From stellaps at cableone.net Thu Jul 11 15:31:59 2013 From: stellaps at cableone.net (Stella Schneider) Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2013 09:31:59 -0600 Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: Yupo question In-Reply-To: References: , , <13E40A95-AB58-44E2-BFAB-6AC9CE966C3C@clemson.edu>, , <5883FBF6-383F-4541-85A0-713123F78743@gmail.com>, <6CE1ED4DD0E94DC4B223D9F411814597@FireBreather>, , <010101ce6ecf$55f6db10$01e49130$@net>, , , <0AD0D39F-B0E4-421D-A802-518DF67ECDE4@gmail.com>, , <668E39D4-B500-453D-9F2E-2DE81CB15E1E@gmail.com>, , <4F74C651-0B0B-4ECC-B9DA-A03221E62713@gmail.com>, , <001801ce7c49$fb679710$f236c530$@net>, , <003101ce7d9e$c4482410$4cd86c30$@net> Message-ID: <002601ce7e4b$ca4109b0$5ec31d10$@net> Marek, Would you please re-post the link to your video? I couldn't get it to work and I am certain it would be helpful. Thanks, Stella -----Original Message----- From: alt-photo-process-list-bounces at lists.altphotolist.org [mailto:alt-photo-process-list-bounces at lists.altphotolist.org] On Behalf Of Marek Matusz Sent: Wednesday, July 10, 2013 8:26 PM To: alt photo Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: Yupo question Stella, I think that roughening of the yupo surface is a good idea. Just cleaning it with some kitchen cleaning powder should perhaps be good for noth roughening the surface and cleaning it. Wash it and dry without touching. In terms of coating you should watch the video that I posted. Spread some gum solution with a brush and then smooth it out with a foam roller. You can take away some coating by rolling the roller on a dry paper towel and on the coated yupo in turns. You can not get layer thin enough just by brushing IMO. Lets us know how it works. Marek > From: stellaps at cableone.net > To: alt-photo-process-list at lists.altphotolist.org > Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2013 12:53:27 -0600 > Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: Yupo question > > Thanks much, Marek. I'll try again. > Stella > > -----Original Message----- > From: alt-photo-process-list-bounces at lists.altphotolist.org > [mailto:alt-photo-process-list-bounces at lists.altphotolist.org] On > Behalf Of Marek Matusz > Sent: Wednesday, July 10, 2013 7:57 AM > To: alt-photo-process-list at lists.altphotolist.org > Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: Yupo question > > Stella. > While coating yupo is certainly a possibility and should help I have > made good looking prints on straight yupo. The trick is to coat a very > very thin gum layer. In practical terms you will need to dilute your mix with water. > Also since yupo is non absorbent you will need much less solution to > coat when compared with paper. > > Marek > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Jul 8, 2013, at 9:14 PM, "Stella Schneider" > wrote: > > > I have seen several people on this list show their gorgeous gum > > prints on Yupo. I have tried it every way from Sunday and get > > nothing but > roll-off. > > Could someone give me some pointers? Gelatin, PVA, plain? Please > > and thank you. > > Stella > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo > _______________________________________________ > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo > > _______________________________________________ > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo _______________________________________________ Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo From emanphoto at gmail.com Thu Jul 11 15:34:53 2013 From: emanphoto at gmail.com (eric nelson) Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2013 22:34:53 +0700 Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: Food Grade Chemicals In-Reply-To: <9B843CFD-7578-4470-8C53-72FA43EC9ED0@comcast.net> References: <9B843CFD-7578-4470-8C53-72FA43EC9ED0@comcast.net> Message-ID: I'd agree on testing first, although in some cases, when making HCA for example, it's kind of hard to test except to make sure that it does indeed clear platinum/palladium prints. But there are residual silver tests for silver gelatin papers which could be employed to make sure it's been cleared of hypo. I've never had a positive test fortunately. :) On Thu, Jul 11, 2013 at 9:12 PM, Jack Fulton wrote: > Not using as many chems as most of you, in my b/w work and out of sodium > carbonate, I found it at a pool supply store > and it worked fine . . later, comparing it with Kodak's product, which was > in appearance much cleaner, I found no difference. > Hence, like Sam, I found no difference but rather than simply switch to > less costly source I'd think it to be wise to compare > initially. > Jack > > > > On Jul 11, 2013, at 5:14 AM, sam wang wrote: > > > The ferric ammonium citrate I received many years ago for cyanotype was > food grade. I think as long as you can find it, food grade or not makes no > difference. > > > > For many years casein was mainly available commercially as a food > source, and smallest quantity you could buy was 50 lbs, at about $1/lb. > > > > Sam > > > > On Jul 11, 2013, at 7:26 AM, eric nelson wrote: > > > >> This is a cross post so sorry if you've getting it again. > >> > >> I've *finally* found ONE chemical supplier here that has some of the > >> chemicals I need and use, but it turns out that they only supply "food > >> grade" chemicals. > >> > >> Now this means that the prices can be cheap, which is good. While > talking > >> to them, I asked about their prices, which they don't list on their > site. ( > >> http://www.ucs1986.com/chemical.htm) They asked me which chems I > wanted, > >> so quickly scanning the list online I figured Sodium metabisulfite would > >> give me a good benchmark as to their prices. 1 kilo is 82 THB which > equals > >> $2.63. > >> > >> Score! > >> > >> Umm, maybe! > >> > >> So my question is, how usable are food grade chemicals in photography? > My > >> guess is that with something like a metal salt (not sure what that > would be > >> doing in "food") in food grade might not be the best choice. This > subject > >> has been covered at length on this apug posting, but goes on ad > nauseum ( > >> > http://www.apug.org/forums/forum37/61248-food-grade-chemistry-ok-use-photography.html > ) > >> and I'm hoping for a more concise discussion from personal experiences > or > >> 2nd hand experiences even. :) > >> > >> e > >> > >> -- > >> Eric Nelson Photography > >> 086 343 1612 > >> http://ericnelsonphoto.tumblr.com/ > >> https://www.facebook.com/EricNelsonPhotographyBangkok > >> _______________________________________________ > >> Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo > > _______________________________________________ > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo > -- Eric Nelson Photography 086 343 1612 http://ericnelsonphoto.tumblr.com/ https://www.facebook.com/EricNelsonPhotographyBangkok From emanphoto at gmail.com Thu Jul 11 15:41:10 2013 From: emanphoto at gmail.com (eric nelson) Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2013 22:41:10 +0700 Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: Food Grade Chemicals In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: That's exactly what I was thinking too Bob. Thanks to all for the reassurance! On Thu, Jul 11, 2013 at 10:30 PM, BOB KISS wrote: > DEAR ERIC, > Many moons have passed, Kimosabe, since my father worked for Merck > and Co...somewhere around the late 30s and then he was a pharmacist's mate > on ships in the Merchant Marines during WW II. But he taught me at the > very > beginning of my photographic endeavors (around 12 years old) that > Photographic Grade chemicals were well below Food Grade in purity and only > slightly better than Technical Grade. Now this was half a century ago so I > don't know if either the grading system has changed or my memory serves me > properly. The only time I would truly care about better than food grade > (Lab or Reagent grade) would be with very expensive metal salts (silver, > gold, platinum, palladium) and other reagents in their respective > processes. > Other than that you should be fine. > CHEERS! > BOB > > -----Original Message----- > From: alt-photo-process-list-bounces at lists.altphotolist.org > [mailto:alt-photo-process-list-bounces at lists.altphotolist.org] On Behalf > Of > eric nelson > Sent: Thursday, July 11, 2013 7:26 AM > To: alt-photo-process-list at lists.altphotolist.org > Subject: [Alt-photo] Food Grade Chemicals > > This is a cross post so sorry if you've getting it again. > > I've *finally* found ONE chemical supplier here that has some of the > chemicals I need and use, but it turns out that they only supply "food > grade" chemicals. > > Now this means that the prices can be cheap, which is good. While talking > to them, I asked about their prices, which they don't list on their site. ( > http://www.ucs1986.com/chemical.htm) They asked me which chems I wanted, > so quickly scanning the list online I figured Sodium metabisulfite would > give me a good benchmark as to their prices. 1 kilo is 82 THB which equals > $2.63. > > Score! > > Umm, maybe! > > So my question is, how usable are food grade chemicals in photography? My > guess is that with something like a metal salt (not sure what that would be > doing in "food") in food grade might not be the best choice. This subject > has been covered at length on this apug posting, but goes on ad nauseum ( > > http://www.apug.org/forums/forum37/61248-food-grade-chemistry-ok-use-photogr > aphy.html > ) > and I'm hoping for a more concise discussion from personal experiences or > 2nd hand experiences even. :) > > e > > -- > Eric Nelson Photography > 086 343 1612 > http://ericnelsonphoto.tumblr.com/ > https://www.facebook.com/EricNelsonPhotographyBangkok > _______________________________________________ > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo > > __________ Information from ESET Smart Security, version of virus signature > database 8554 (20130711) __________ > > The message was checked by ESET Smart Security. > > http://www.eset.com > > > > _______________________________________________ > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo > -- Eric Nelson Photography 086 343 1612 http://ericnelsonphoto.tumblr.com/ https://www.facebook.com/EricNelsonPhotographyBangkok From mustafaumutsarac at gmail.com Thu Jul 11 18:45:32 2013 From: mustafaumutsarac at gmail.com (Mustafa Umut Sarac) Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2013 21:45:32 +0300 Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: Food Grade Chemicals In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Lab Grade Erythrosine from Sigma : 1 grams 600 dollars Erythrosine from alibaba.com : 1 grams 30 cents You can pay 2000 times more money , I cant. Umut On Thu, Jul 11, 2013 at 6:41 PM, eric nelson wrote: > That's exactly what I was thinking too Bob. > Thanks > to > all > for the reassurance! > > > > On Thu, Jul 11, 2013 at 10:30 PM, BOB KISS wrote: > > > DEAR ERIC, > > Many moons have passed, Kimosabe, since my father worked for > Merck > > and Co...somewhere around the late 30s and then he was a pharmacist's > mate > > on ships in the Merchant Marines during WW II. But he taught me at the > > very > > beginning of my photographic endeavors (around 12 years old) that > > Photographic Grade chemicals were well below Food Grade in purity and > only > > slightly better than Technical Grade. Now this was half a century ago > so I > > don't know if either the grading system has changed or my memory serves > me > > properly. The only time I would truly care about better than food grade > > (Lab or Reagent grade) would be with very expensive metal salts (silver, > > gold, platinum, palladium) and other reagents in their respective > > processes. > > Other than that you should be fine. > > CHEERS! > > BOB > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: alt-photo-process-list-bounces at lists.altphotolist.org > > [mailto:alt-photo-process-list-bounces at lists.altphotolist.org] On Behalf > > Of > > eric nelson > > Sent: Thursday, July 11, 2013 7:26 AM > > To: alt-photo-process-list at lists.altphotolist.org > > Subject: [Alt-photo] Food Grade Chemicals > > > > This is a cross post so sorry if you've getting it again. > > > > I've *finally* found ONE chemical supplier here that has some of the > > chemicals I need and use, but it turns out that they only supply "food > > grade" chemicals. > > > > Now this means that the prices can be cheap, which is good. While > talking > > to them, I asked about their prices, which they don't list on their > site. ( > > http://www.ucs1986.com/chemical.htm) They asked me which chems I > wanted, > > so quickly scanning the list online I figured Sodium metabisulfite would > > give me a good benchmark as to their prices. 1 kilo is 82 THB which > equals > > $2.63. > > > > Score! > > > > Umm, maybe! > > > > So my question is, how usable are food grade chemicals in photography? > My > > guess is that with something like a metal salt (not sure what that would > be > > doing in "food") in food grade might not be the best choice. This > subject > > has been covered at length on this apug posting, but goes on ad nauseum > ( > > > > > http://www.apug.org/forums/forum37/61248-food-grade-chemistry-ok-use-photogr > > aphy.html< > http://www.apug.org/forums/forum37/61248-food-grade-chemistry-ok-use-photography.html > > > > ) > > and I'm hoping for a more concise discussion from personal experiences or > > 2nd hand experiences even. :) > > > > e > > > > -- > > Eric Nelson Photography > > 086 343 1612 > > http://ericnelsonphoto.tumblr.com/ > > https://www.facebook.com/EricNelsonPhotographyBangkok > > _______________________________________________ > > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo > > > > __________ Information from ESET Smart Security, version of virus > signature > > database 8554 (20130711) __________ > > > > The message was checked by ESET Smart Security. > > > > http://www.eset.com > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo > > > > > > -- > Eric Nelson Photography > 086 343 1612 > http://ericnelsonphoto.tumblr.com/ > https://www.facebook.com/EricNelsonPhotographyBangkok > _______________________________________________ > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo > From marekmatusz at hotmail.com Fri Jul 12 02:54:03 2013 From: marekmatusz at hotmail.com (Marek Matusz) Date: Fri, 12 Jul 2013 02:54:03 +0000 Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: Yupo question In-Reply-To: <002601ce7e4b$ca4109b0$5ec31d10$@net> References: , , , , <13E40A95-AB58-44E2-BFAB-6AC9CE966C3C@clemson.edu>, , , , <5883FBF6-383F-4541-85A0-713123F78743@gmail.com>, , <6CE1ED4DD0E94DC4B223D9F411814597@FireBreather>, , , , <010101ce6ecf$55f6db10$01e49130$@net>, , , , , , <0AD0D39F-B0E4-421D-A802-518DF67ECDE4@gmail.com>, , , , <668E39D4-B500-453D-9F2E-2DE81CB15E1E@gmail.com>, , , , <4F74C651-0B0B-4ECC-B9DA-A03221E62713@gmail.com>, , , , <001801ce7c49$fb679710$f236c530$@net>, , , , <003101ce7d9e$c4482410$4cd86c30$@net> , <002601ce7e4b$ca4109b0$5ec31d10$@net> Message-ID: Stella, This is the link to the folder with my recent gums and video https://plus.google.com/photos/105732508998271877151/albums/5882305049320410433 this is the video link https://plus.google.com/photos/105732508998271877151/albums/5882305049320410433/5892374828251913010?pid=5892374828251913010&oid=105732508998271877151 hope you get them to work I tested them both. You might need to copy and paste the address into your browser Marek > From: stellaps at cableone.net > To: alt-photo-process-list at lists.altphotolist.org > Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2013 09:31:59 -0600 > Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: Yupo question > > Marek, > Would you please re-post the link to your video? I couldn't get it to work > and I am certain it would be helpful. > Thanks, > Stella > > -----Original Message----- > From: alt-photo-process-list-bounces at lists.altphotolist.org > [mailto:alt-photo-process-list-bounces at lists.altphotolist.org] On Behalf Of > Marek Matusz > Sent: Wednesday, July 10, 2013 8:26 PM > To: alt photo > Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: Yupo question > > Stella, > > I think that roughening of the yupo surface is a good idea. Just cleaning > it with some kitchen cleaning powder should perhaps be good for noth > roughening the surface and cleaning it. Wash it and dry without touching. > > In terms of coating you should watch the video that I posted. Spread some > gum solution with a brush and then smooth it out with a foam roller. You can > take away some coating by rolling the roller on a dry paper towel and on the > coated yupo in turns. You can not get layer thin enough just by brushing > IMO. > > Lets us know how it works. > > Marek > > > From: stellaps at cableone.net > > To: alt-photo-process-list at lists.altphotolist.org > > Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2013 12:53:27 -0600 > > Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: Yupo question > > > > Thanks much, Marek. I'll try again. > > Stella > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: alt-photo-process-list-bounces at lists.altphotolist.org > > [mailto:alt-photo-process-list-bounces at lists.altphotolist.org] On > > Behalf Of Marek Matusz > > Sent: Wednesday, July 10, 2013 7:57 AM > > To: alt-photo-process-list at lists.altphotolist.org > > Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: Yupo question > > > > Stella. > > While coating yupo is certainly a possibility and should help I have > > made good looking prints on straight yupo. The trick is to coat a very > > very thin gum layer. In practical terms you will need to dilute your mix > with water. > > Also since yupo is non absorbent you will need much less solution to > > coat when compared with paper. > > > > Marek > > > > Sent from my iPhone > > > > On Jul 8, 2013, at 9:14 PM, "Stella Schneider" > > wrote: > > > > > I have seen several people on this list show their gorgeous gum > > > prints on Yupo. I have tried it every way from Sunday and get > > > nothing but > > roll-off. > > > Could someone give me some pointers? Gelatin, PVA, plain? Please > > > and thank you. > > > Stella > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo > > _______________________________________________ > > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo > > _______________________________________________ > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo > > _______________________________________________ > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo From donsbryant at gmail.com Fri Jul 12 02:57:08 2013 From: donsbryant at gmail.com (Don) Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2013 22:57:08 -0400 Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: Yupo question In-Reply-To: References: , , , , <13E40A95-AB58-44E2-BFAB-6AC9CE966C3C@clemson.edu>, , , , <5883FBF6-383F-4541-85A0-713123F78743@gmail.com>, , <6CE1ED4DD0E94DC4B223D9F411814597@FireBreather>, , , , <010101ce6ecf$55f6db10$01e49130$@net>, , , , , , <0AD0D39F-B0E4-421D-A802-518DF67ECDE4@gmail.com>, , , , <668E39D4-B500-453D-9F2E-2DE81CB15E1E@gmail.com>, , , , <4F74C651-0B0B-4ECC-B9DA-A03221E62713@gmail.com>, , , , <001801ce7c49$fb679710$f236c530$@net>, , , , <003101ce7d9e$c4482410$4cd 86c30$@net> , <002601ce7e4b$ca4109b0$5ec31d10$@net> Message-ID: <2441F613717C4029A31FA24BCC4EF0D0@FireBreather> A tiny url is usually easier to deal with: http://tinyurl.com/ltxcsg6 - video link -----Original Message----- From: alt-photo-process-list-bounces at lists.altphotolist.org [mailto:alt-photo-process-list-bounces at lists.altphotolist.org] On Behalf Of Marek Matusz Sent: Thursday, July 11, 2013 10:54 PM To: alt photo Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: Yupo question Stella, This is the link to the folder with my recent gums and video https://plus.google.com/photos/105732508998271877151/albums/5882305049320410 433 this is the video link https://plus.google.com/photos/105732508998271877151/albums/5882305049320410 433/5892374828251913010?pid=5892374828251913010&oid=105732508998271877151 hope you get them to work I tested them both. You might need to copy and paste the address into your browser Marek > From: stellaps at cableone.net > To: alt-photo-process-list at lists.altphotolist.org > Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2013 09:31:59 -0600 > Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: Yupo question > > Marek, > Would you please re-post the link to your video? I couldn't get it to work > and I am certain it would be helpful. > Thanks, > Stella > > -----Original Message----- > From: alt-photo-process-list-bounces at lists.altphotolist.org > [mailto:alt-photo-process-list-bounces at lists.altphotolist.org] On Behalf Of > Marek Matusz > Sent: Wednesday, July 10, 2013 8:26 PM > To: alt photo > Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: Yupo question > > Stella, > > I think that roughening of the yupo surface is a good idea. Just cleaning > it with some kitchen cleaning powder should perhaps be good for noth > roughening the surface and cleaning it. Wash it and dry without touching. > > In terms of coating you should watch the video that I posted. Spread some > gum solution with a brush and then smooth it out with a foam roller. You can > take away some coating by rolling the roller on a dry paper towel and on the > coated yupo in turns. You can not get layer thin enough just by brushing > IMO. > > Lets us know how it works. > > Marek > > > From: stellaps at cableone.net > > To: alt-photo-process-list at lists.altphotolist.org > > Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2013 12:53:27 -0600 > > Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: Yupo question > > > > Thanks much, Marek. I'll try again. > > Stella > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: alt-photo-process-list-bounces at lists.altphotolist.org > > [mailto:alt-photo-process-list-bounces at lists.altphotolist.org] On > > Behalf Of Marek Matusz > > Sent: Wednesday, July 10, 2013 7:57 AM > > To: alt-photo-process-list at lists.altphotolist.org > > Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: Yupo question > > > > Stella. > > While coating yupo is certainly a possibility and should help I have > > made good looking prints on straight yupo. The trick is to coat a very > > very thin gum layer. In practical terms you will need to dilute your mix > with water. > > Also since yupo is non absorbent you will need much less solution to > > coat when compared with paper. > > > > Marek > > > > Sent from my iPhone > > > > On Jul 8, 2013, at 9:14 PM, "Stella Schneider" > > wrote: > > > > > I have seen several people on this list show their gorgeous gum > > > prints on Yupo. I have tried it every way from Sunday and get > > > nothing but > > roll-off. > > > Could someone give me some pointers? Gelatin, PVA, plain? Please > > > and thank you. > > > Stella > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo > > _______________________________________________ > > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo > > _______________________________________________ > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo > > _______________________________________________ > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo _______________________________________________ Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo From emanphoto at gmail.com Fri Jul 12 04:21:51 2013 From: emanphoto at gmail.com (eric nelson) Date: Fri, 12 Jul 2013 11:21:51 +0700 Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: Food Grade Chemicals In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Nope I can't either! On Fri, Jul 12, 2013 at 1:45 AM, Mustafa Umut Sarac < mustafaumutsarac at gmail.com> wrote: > Lab Grade Erythrosine from Sigma : 1 grams 600 dollars > Erythrosine from alibaba.com : 1 grams 30 cents > > You can pay 2000 times more money , I cant. > > Umut > > > > On Thu, Jul 11, 2013 at 6:41 PM, eric nelson wrote: > > > That's exactly what I was thinking too Bob. > > Thanks > > to > > all > > for the reassurance! > > > > > > > > On Thu, Jul 11, 2013 at 10:30 PM, BOB KISS > wrote: > > > > > DEAR ERIC, > > > Many moons have passed, Kimosabe, since my father worked for > > Merck > > > and Co...somewhere around the late 30s and then he was a pharmacist's > > mate > > > on ships in the Merchant Marines during WW II. But he taught me at the > > > very > > > beginning of my photographic endeavors (around 12 years old) that > > > Photographic Grade chemicals were well below Food Grade in purity and > > only > > > slightly better than Technical Grade. Now this was half a century ago > > so I > > > don't know if either the grading system has changed or my memory serves > > me > > > properly. The only time I would truly care about better than food > grade > > > (Lab or Reagent grade) would be with very expensive metal salts > (silver, > > > gold, platinum, palladium) and other reagents in their respective > > > processes. > > > Other than that you should be fine. > > > CHEERS! > > > BOB > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: alt-photo-process-list-bounces at lists.altphotolist.org > > > [mailto:alt-photo-process-list-bounces at lists.altphotolist.org] On > Behalf > > > Of > > > eric nelson > > > Sent: Thursday, July 11, 2013 7:26 AM > > > To: alt-photo-process-list at lists.altphotolist.org > > > Subject: [Alt-photo] Food Grade Chemicals > > > > > > This is a cross post so sorry if you've getting it again. > > > > > > I've *finally* found ONE chemical supplier here that has some of the > > > chemicals I need and use, but it turns out that they only supply "food > > > grade" chemicals. > > > > > > Now this means that the prices can be cheap, which is good. While > > talking > > > to them, I asked about their prices, which they don't list on their > > site. ( > > > http://www.ucs1986.com/chemical.htm) They asked me which chems I > > wanted, > > > so quickly scanning the list online I figured Sodium metabisulfite > would > > > give me a good benchmark as to their prices. 1 kilo is 82 THB which > > equals > > > $2.63. > > > > > > Score! > > > > > > Umm, maybe! > > > > > > So my question is, how usable are food grade chemicals in photography? > > My > > > guess is that with something like a metal salt (not sure what that > would > > be > > > doing in "food") in food grade might not be the best choice. This > > subject > > > has been covered at length on this apug posting, but goes on ad > nauseum > > ( > > > > > > > > > http://www.apug.org/forums/forum37/61248-food-grade-chemistry-ok-use-photogr > > > aphy.html< > > > http://www.apug.org/forums/forum37/61248-food-grade-chemistry-ok-use-photography.html > > > > > > ) > > > and I'm hoping for a more concise discussion from personal experiences > or > > > 2nd hand experiences even. :) > > > > > > e > > > > > > -- > > > Eric Nelson Photography > > > 086 343 1612 > > > http://ericnelsonphoto.tumblr.com/ > > > https://www.facebook.com/EricNelsonPhotographyBangkok > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo > > > > > > __________ Information from ESET Smart Security, version of virus > > signature > > > database 8554 (20130711) __________ > > > > > > The message was checked by ESET Smart Security. > > > > > > http://www.eset.com > > > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > Eric Nelson Photography > > 086 343 1612 > > http://ericnelsonphoto.tumblr.com/ > > https://www.facebook.com/EricNelsonPhotographyBangkok > > _______________________________________________ > > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo > > > _______________________________________________ > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo > -- Eric Nelson Photography 086 343 1612 http://ericnelsonphoto.tumblr.com/ https://www.facebook.com/EricNelsonPhotographyBangkok From tboley at tylerboley.com Sat Jul 13 00:36:40 2013 From: tboley at tylerboley.com (Tyler Boley) Date: Fri, 12 Jul 2013 17:36:40 -0700 Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: one day print workshop In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <51E0A118.5090600@tylerboley.com> I should add we?ll have salted paper, albumen paper, silver gelatin, palladium and gum over palladium, ink on the premium inkjet papers, uncoated Arches, BFK, Japanese papers, tissue.. quad, dual quad, K7... a rare opportunity to investigate a wide variety of unique and beautiful processes. > Ron Reeder and I will jointly give a one day class about a variety of > print methods. I am primarily an inkjet guy, but Ron is a platinum > palladium expert and makes digital negs, so I hope this is relevant on > this list- > > http://www.custom-digital.com/2013/07/workshop-a-day-with-two-expert-printers/ > > Thanks, > Tyler > From unglobetrotteur at hotmail.com Sat Jul 13 01:43:49 2013 From: unglobetrotteur at hotmail.com (Un Globe Trotteur) Date: Fri, 12 Jul 2013 21:43:49 -0400 Subject: [Alt-photo] Beta of Squeeze released In-Reply-To: <51D8EBA1.7040502@tylerboley.com> References: <51D8EBA1.7040502@tylerboley.com> Message-ID: After months of programming, I am releasing version 4.5 of squeeze, the automated alternative process curves creator. The new version has a new interface, collapsible panels, ability to print CMY layers and add/move/resize registration marks. The editor has 3 built-in filters. You can either use a scanner or a densitometer. You can find the program under the download section on my web site. http://www.PierreOlivierTavernier.com Sincerely, PO From glsmyth at yahoo.com Mon Jul 15 00:08:25 2013 From: glsmyth at yahoo.com (George L Smyth) Date: Sun, 14 Jul 2013 17:08:25 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: Beta of Squeeze released In-Reply-To: References: <51D8EBA1.7040502@tylerboley.com> Message-ID: <1373846905.8264.YahooMailNeo@web164003.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> How do you turn the music off? george ? -------------------------------------- Bromoil: http://GeorgeSmyth.com Handmade Photographic Images: http://www.GLSmyth.com Blog: http://GLSmyth.wordpress.com ----- Original Message ----- From: Un Globe Trotteur To: alt-photo-process-list at lists.altphotolist.org Cc: Sent: Friday, July 12, 2013 9:43 PM Subject: [Alt-photo] Beta of Squeeze released After months of programming, I am releasing version 4.5 of squeeze, the automated alternative process curves creator. The new version has a new interface, collapsible panels, ability to print CMY layers and add/move/resize registration marks. The editor has 3 built-in filters. You can either use a scanner or a densitometer. You can find the program under the download section on my web site. http://www.PierreOlivierTavernier.com Sincerely, PO _______________________________________________ Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo From unglobetrotteur at hotmail.com Mon Jul 15 00:19:59 2013 From: unglobetrotteur at hotmail.com (Un Globe Trotteur) Date: Sun, 14 Jul 2013 20:19:59 -0400 Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: Beta of Squeeze released In-Reply-To: <1373846905.8264.YahooMailNeo@web164003.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> References: <51D8EBA1.7040502@tylerboley.com> <1373846905.8264.YahooMailNeo@web164003.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: I assume you mean on the web site :) Just click any button such as download and it will go to other screen . Or you can mute your volume.. I will try to add the navigation bar to the flash player to enable/disable the audio. Great suggestion. Thanks. -----Original Message----- From: George L Smyth Sent: Sunday, July 14, 2013 8:08 PM To: alt-photo-process-list at lists.altphotolist.org Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: Beta of Squeeze released How do you turn the music off? george -------------------------------------- Bromoil: http://GeorgeSmyth.com Handmade Photographic Images: http://www.GLSmyth.com Blog: http://GLSmyth.wordpress.com ----- Original Message ----- From: Un Globe Trotteur To: alt-photo-process-list at lists.altphotolist.org Cc: Sent: Friday, July 12, 2013 9:43 PM Subject: [Alt-photo] Beta of Squeeze released After months of programming, I am releasing version 4.5 of squeeze, the automated alternative process curves creator. The new version has a new interface, collapsible panels, ability to print CMY layers and add/move/resize registration marks. The editor has 3 built-in filters. You can either use a scanner or a densitometer. You can find the program under the download section on my web site. http://www.PierreOlivierTavernier.com Sincerely, PO _______________________________________________ Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo _______________________________________________ Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo From mjkoskin at gmail.com Mon Jul 15 18:36:13 2013 From: mjkoskin at gmail.com (Matti Koskinen) Date: Mon, 15 Jul 2013 21:36:13 +0300 Subject: [Alt-photo] darkroom safelight Message-ID: <7FE7AC16-47A5-4BA1-9FC6-3B14A809749B@gmail.com> hi all, my red bulb, probably some 20 years old just died. I have an amber new bulb, but the colour is not suitable for Kentmere VC, which I use as paper negs for Bulldog and pinhole. It fogs badly. New bulbs I haven't found, so I decided to ask what about red leds? They're cheap, I've used them lot in crazy projects. Anyone using them? Or buy a sheet of red acrylic and cover a lamp fixture? Or buy a red safelight, which costs 30?? tia -matti From aschmitt at aandy.org Mon Jul 15 18:47:40 2013 From: aschmitt at aandy.org (andy schmitt) Date: Mon, 15 Jul 2013 14:47:40 -0400 Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: darkroom safelight In-Reply-To: <7FE7AC16-47A5-4BA1-9FC6-3B14A809749B@gmail.com> References: <7FE7AC16-47A5-4BA1-9FC6-3B14A809749B@gmail.com> Message-ID: <112701ce818b$c9886700$5c993500$@aandy.org> The red LEDS SHOULD be ok... we use them for paper here... You can't find a red "party" bulb at your home supply box store? Regards Andy Schmitt Head of The New & Improved Photography Dept, Peters Valley School of Craft http://www.petersvalley.org/html/Photography.cfm -----Original Message----- From: alt-photo-process-list-bounces at lists.altphotolist.org [mailto:alt-photo-process-list-bounces at lists.altphotolist.org] On Behalf Of Matti Koskinen Sent: Monday, July 15, 2013 2:36 PM To: The alternative photographic processes mailing list Subject: [Alt-photo] darkroom safelight hi all, my red bulb, probably some 20 years old just died. I have an amber new bulb, but the colour is not suitable for Kentmere VC, which I use as paper negs for Bulldog and pinhole. It fogs badly. New bulbs I haven't found, so I decided to ask what about red leds? They're cheap, I've used them lot in crazy projects. Anyone using them? Or buy a sheet of red acrylic and cover a lamp fixture? Or buy a red safelight, which costs 30?? tia -matti _______________________________________________ Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo From bobkiss at caribsurf.com Mon Jul 15 18:48:27 2013 From: bobkiss at caribsurf.com (BOB KISS) Date: Mon, 15 Jul 2013 14:48:27 -0400 Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: darkroom safelight In-Reply-To: <7FE7AC16-47A5-4BA1-9FC6-3B14A809749B@gmail.com> References: <7FE7AC16-47A5-4BA1-9FC6-3B14A809749B@gmail.com> Message-ID: DEAR MATTI, Two options: 1) ebay for a cheap safelight & filter. 2) Rubylith...a sheet of plastic that is very close in color to a red safelight filter. You may still be able to find these at prepress and printing (offset web press type of printing) shops. You might even find some hidden in the back room of your nearest newspaper. Good Luck! BOB -----Original Message----- From: alt-photo-process-list-bounces at lists.altphotolist.org [mailto:alt-photo-process-list-bounces at lists.altphotolist.org] On Behalf Of Matti Koskinen Sent: Monday, July 15, 2013 2:36 PM To: The alternative photographic processes mailing list Subject: [Alt-photo] darkroom safelight hi all, my red bulb, probably some 20 years old just died. I have an amber new bulb, but the colour is not suitable for Kentmere VC, which I use as paper negs for Bulldog and pinhole. It fogs badly. New bulbs I haven't found, so I decided to ask what about red leds? They're cheap, I've used them lot in crazy projects. Anyone using them? Or buy a sheet of red acrylic and cover a lamp fixture? Or buy a red safelight, which costs 30?? tia -matti _______________________________________________ Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo __________ Information from ESET Smart Security, version of virus signature database 8570 (20130715) __________ The message was checked by ESET Smart Security. http://www.eset.com From gjh at shaw.ca Mon Jul 15 18:52:41 2013 From: gjh at shaw.ca (Gordon Holtslander) Date: Mon, 15 Jul 2013 12:52:41 -0600 (MDT) Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: darkroom safelight In-Reply-To: <7FE7AC16-47A5-4BA1-9FC6-3B14A809749B@gmail.com> Message-ID: <1531227978.8181136.1373914361775.JavaMail.root@cds006> Try these: http://www.apug.org/forums/forum43/95317-my-new-diy-led-red-safelight.html Gordon J. Holtslander gjh at shaw.ca Learn about HSP http://sp-foundation.org ----- Original Message ----- From: "Matti Koskinen" To: "The alternative photographic processes mailing list" Sent: Monday, July 15, 2013 12:36:13 PM Subject: [Alt-photo] darkroom safelight hi all, my red bulb, probably some 20 years old just died. I have an amber new bulb, but the colour is not suitable for Kentmere VC, which I use as paper negs for Bulldog and pinhole. It fogs badly. New bulbs I haven't found, so I decided to ask what about red leds? They're cheap, I've used them lot in crazy projects. Anyone using them? Or buy a sheet of red acrylic and cover a lamp fixture? Or buy a red safelight, which costs 30?? tia -matti _______________________________________________ Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo From mjkoskin at gmail.com Mon Jul 15 19:56:13 2013 From: mjkoskin at gmail.com (Matti Koskinen) Date: Mon, 15 Jul 2013 22:56:13 +0300 Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: darkroom safelight In-Reply-To: <1531227978.8181136.1373914361775.JavaMail.root@cds006> References: <1531227978.8181136.1373914361775.JavaMail.root@cds006> Message-ID: <84A5E790-5491-4D8F-B41D-1ABCFAF8A46B@gmail.com> thanks all for the info. Red leds are the way to go. I think even my red led alarm clock might be enough :-) And it has a radio too! -matti From pfriedrichsen at sympatico.ca Mon Jul 15 22:32:50 2013 From: pfriedrichsen at sympatico.ca (Peter Friedrichsen) Date: Mon, 15 Jul 2013 18:32:50 -0400 Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: darkroom safelight In-Reply-To: <7FE7AC16-47A5-4BA1-9FC6-3B14A809749B@gmail.com> References: <7FE7AC16-47A5-4BA1-9FC6-3B14A809749B@gmail.com> Message-ID: If you are in the decorative mood, you buy a string of red LED Christmas lights, then when you close up shop for the holidays, you could string them around as holiday decor; maybe rinse those chemicals off first ;) Peter Friedrichsen At 02:36 PM 15/07/2013, you wrote: >hi all, >my red bulb, probably some 20 years old just >died. I have an amber new bulb, but the colour >is not suitable for Kentmere VC, which I use as >paper negs for Bulldog and pinhole. It fogs >badly. New bulbs I haven't found, so I decided >to ask what about red leds? They're cheap, I've >used them lot in crazy projects. Anyone using them? >Or buy a sheet of red acrylic and cover a lamp >fixture? Or buy a red safelight, which costs 30?? > >tia > >-matti > >_______________________________________________ >Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo From alt.photosbyjeremy at gmail.com Tue Jul 16 16:54:57 2013 From: alt.photosbyjeremy at gmail.com (Jeremy Moore) Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2013 11:54:57 -0500 Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: Ultrafine transparency In-Reply-To: References: <13E40A95-AB58-44E2-BFAB-6AC9CE966C3C@clemson.edu> <5883FBF6-383F-4541-85A0-713123F78743@gmail.com> <6CE1ED4DD0E94DC4B223D9F411814597@FireBreather> Message-ID: This is a different beast than the old stuff, but I made negatives on it last night using an Epson 1400 for platinum/palladium and I don't have anything to complain about the final prints they created. - Jeremy On Fri, Jul 5, 2013 at 7:29 PM, Marek Matusz wrote: > Jeremy, > > I ran out of my old ultrafine transparency, but photowarehouse now lists > Ultrafine Waterproof Inkjet Film. Is that what you are buying now? Did you > try printing negatives on it yet? Is this the same as the old material or > better (in terms of ink holding capacity) . I want to buy a pack of large > size sheets and want to make sure I get the right stuff before I spent $100. > > Marek > > > _______________________________________________ > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo > From jacqueskv at gmail.com Tue Jul 16 16:59:00 2013 From: jacqueskv at gmail.com (Jacques Kevers) Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2013 18:59:00 +0200 Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: darkroom safelight In-Reply-To: <7FE7AC16-47A5-4BA1-9FC6-3B14A809749B@gmail.com> References: <7FE7AC16-47A5-4BA1-9FC6-3B14A809749B@gmail.com> Message-ID: You might look for a red 2.5W Optiled "festoon", whose output is around 627 nm... Should cost around 10$. JK 2013/7/15 Matti Koskinen > hi all, > my red bulb, probably some 20 years old just died. I have an amber new > bulb, but the colour is not suitable for Kentmere VC, which I use as paper > negs for Bulldog and pinhole. It fogs badly. New bulbs I haven't found, so > I decided to ask what about red leds? They're cheap, I've used them lot in > crazy projects. Anyone using them? > Or buy a sheet of red acrylic and cover a lamp fixture? Or buy a red > safelight, which costs 30?? > > tia > > -matti > > _______________________________________________ > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo > From pfriedrichsen at sympatico.ca Tue Jul 16 22:40:33 2013 From: pfriedrichsen at sympatico.ca (Peter Friedrichsen) Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2013 18:40:33 -0400 Subject: [Alt-photo] Inkjet transparencies(microporous) and pigment inks Message-ID: How well does the ink from pigment printers sink into the coating of these transparencies? Is the transparency easily damaged from scratches such that the pigment may scrape off the surface or is it well sunk in below the surface? Is there any need to seal the transparencies with whatever? I am still using dyes but have a requirement for a stronger UV block as some UV still seems to pass through the photo-black dye. Do the pigments do a better job of blocking UV? Peter Friedrichsen From alt.photosbyjeremy at gmail.com Tue Jul 16 22:48:15 2013 From: alt.photosbyjeremy at gmail.com (Jeremy Moore) Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2013 17:48:15 -0500 Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: Inkjet transparencies(microporous) and pigment inks In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <459C37BB-45E3-4155-992F-81FF29284E1A@gmail.com> My experience with Epson inks on ultrafine, pictorico, and inkpress is as follows: Claria dye inks do block enough UV through QTR to print pt/pd with an Epson 1400. The K3 pigment inks in my Epson 7800 block more UV than the dyes do so making negatives for salt prints is much easier, but it's 6 in one, half dozen in the other when it comes to pt/pd. While they can be scratched, Neither ink (pigment or dye) is easily scratched off the negatives nor do they require any kind I sealing. Jeremy who's heading home to make pt/pd prints for the next 4 hours :) On Jul 16, 2013, at 5:40 PM, Peter Friedrichsen wrote: > How well does the ink from pigment printers sink into the coating of these transparencies? Is the transparency easily damaged from scratches such that the pigment may scrape off the surface or is it well sunk in below the surface? Is there any need to seal the transparencies with whatever? > > I am still using dyes but have a requirement for a stronger UV block as some UV still seems to pass through the photo-black dye. Do the pigments do a better job of blocking UV? > > Peter Friedrichsen > > _______________________________________________ > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo From dspector at charter.net Tue Jul 16 22:52:23 2013 From: dspector at charter.net (Denny) Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2013 15:52:23 -0700 Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: Inkjet transparencies(microporous) and pigment inks In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <002301ce8277$22f95dd0$68ec1970$@charter.net> I think this probably depends on the transparency material and printer and printing method. I find with an Epson 2880 printing onto Pictorico the negatives are durable with normal handling, but it's possible to scratch them if I get sloppy. I've never sealed them. I get great blocking using Dan Burkholder's colorized negative system, I don't use pure black ink. -----Original Message----- From: alt-photo-process-list-bounces at lists.altphotolist.org [mailto:alt-photo-process-list-bounces at lists.altphotolist.org] On Behalf Of Peter Friedrichsen Sent: Tuesday, July 16, 2013 3:41 PM To: alt-photo-process-list at lists.altphotolist.org Subject: [Alt-photo] Inkjet transparencies(microporous) and pigment inks How well does the ink from pigment printers sink into the coating of these transparencies? Is the transparency easily damaged from scratches such that the pigment may scrape off the surface or is it well sunk in below the surface? Is there any need to seal the transparencies with whatever? I am still using dyes but have a requirement for a stronger UV block as some UV still seems to pass through the photo-black dye. Do the pigments do a better job of blocking UV? Peter Friedrichsen _______________________________________________ Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo From sanking at clemson.edu Tue Jul 16 23:07:24 2013 From: sanking at clemson.edu (Sandy King) Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2013 19:07:24 -0400 Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: Inkjet transparencies(microporous) and pigment inks In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Peter, It really depends on the specific transparency material and the specific pigment ink set. Pictorico and a number of similar products produced by Mitsubishi Imaging (Arista, Inkpress) have a coating that takes the Epson Ultrachrome and K3 pigment inks well, and the coating dries fairly hard, especially with photo black ink, or with the MPS ink of Cone K7 ink sets. There is no need to seal the transparency, but I protect it by taping a thin layer of polyester over the pigment coating. A number of other transparency materials do not dry hard in my experience. Specifically, I have had unsatisfactory results with the inexpensive Ultrafine transparency. But my negatives for pt/pd and carbon transfer need a high density range. If you require only a thin layer as for gum Ultrafine seems to work OK, though certainly the pigment inks do not dry as fast or as hard as on the Pictorico type transparency. I don't believe there is an absolute answer to your question about which is the stronger UV blocker, pigments or dyes. Some dyes seem to block UV well, others do not. And some ink pigment ink sets block much better than others. Sandy On Jul 16, 2013, at 6:40 PM, Peter Friedrichsen wrote: > How well does the ink from pigment printers sink into the coating of these transparencies? Is the transparency easily damaged from scratches such that the pigment may scrape off the surface or is it well sunk in below the surface? Is there any need to seal the transparencies with whatever? > > I am still using dyes but have a requirement for a stronger UV block as some UV still seems to pass through the photo-black dye. Do the pigments do a better job of blocking UV? > > Peter Friedrichsen > > _______________________________________________ > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo From bobkiss at caribsurf.com Wed Jul 17 15:31:16 2013 From: bobkiss at caribsurf.com (BOB KISS) Date: Wed, 17 Jul 2013 11:31:16 -0400 Subject: [Alt-photo] A DEFINITIVE ANSWER? Message-ID: DEAR LIST, Can I or can I not bleach (even slightly) a print made mostly of palladium? I have a print made of 95% palladium and it is a bit dark. 1) Most books on pt/pd printing warn against using HCl as the first clearing bath with palladium prints because it can bleach them. 2) Don Bryant posted Michael Mutmansky?s procedure for bleaching out black spots on pt/pd prints by first placing some dilute HCl on the spot and then some dilute chlorine bleach on the same spot. Might this work on a macro scale by first immersing a print in the dilute HCl then into the dilute bleach? 3) But, on the other hand, some people say that it is impossible to bleach up a dark palladium print. Am I the only one who finds this contradictory? Soooooooooooooooooooooo, has anyone had success slightly bleaching up a dark palladium print? Or does this sound feasible? Of course I am making another lighter print but is there any way not to waste the dark one? CHEERS! BOB Please check my website: http://www.bobkiss.com/ "Live as if you are going to die tomorrow. Learn as if you are going to live forever". Mahatma Gandhi "Earth" without "art" is just "Eh"! (Anonymous graffiti posted on Facebook) ?Madonne e fiori, trionfo eterno di giovent?!? from Mattinata Fiorentina by Antonella Ruggiero __________ Information from ESET Smart Security, version of virus signature database 8577 (20130717) __________ The message was checked by ESET Smart Security. http://www.eset.com From payral at gmail.com Wed Jul 17 15:41:41 2013 From: payral at gmail.com (Philippe Ayral) Date: Wed, 17 Jul 2013 17:41:41 +0200 Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: A DEFINITIVE ANSWER? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: I did try procedure for bleaching out black spots on pt/pd prints using very dilute HCl and then very dilute chlorine in a tray but never really succeed. If you want to try you will have to do it outside, fumes are really dangerous and I am not chemicals paranoic as lot of people are. HCL bleaching will bleach a little highlights but not shadows. Somebody has to find potassium ferricyanide equivalent for palladium prints [image: Avatar] *Philippe Ayral** Photographie* 52, rue de Vallard - 74240 Gaillard T?l: 04 50 39 79 81 www.payral.fr Designed with WiseStamp - Get yours 2013/7/17 BOB KISS > DEAR LIST, > > Can I or can I not bleach (even slightly) a print made mostly > of > palladium? I have a print made of 95% palladium and it is a bit dark. > > 1) Most books on pt/pd printing warn against using HCl as the first > clearing bath with palladium prints because it can bleach them. > > 2) Don Bryant posted Michael Mutmansky?s procedure for bleaching out black > spots on pt/pd prints by first placing some dilute HCl on the spot and then > some dilute chlorine bleach on the same spot. Might this work on a macro > scale by first immersing a print in the dilute HCl then into the dilute > bleach? > > 3) But, on the other hand, some people say that it is impossible to bleach > up a dark palladium print. > > Am I the only one who finds this contradictory? > > Soooooooooooooooooooooo, has anyone had success slightly > bleaching up a dark palladium print? Or does this sound feasible? > > Of course I am making another lighter print but is there any way not to > waste the dark one? > > > CHEERS! > > > BOB > > > > Please check my website: > http://www.bobkiss.com/ > > > > > "Live as if you are going to die tomorrow. Learn as if you are going to > live forever". Mahatma Gandhi > > > > "Earth" without "art" is just "Eh"! (Anonymous graffiti posted on > Facebook) > > > > ?Madonne e fiori, trionfo eterno di giovent?!? from Mattinata Fiorentina > by > Antonella Ruggiero > > > > > > > > __________ Information from ESET Smart Security, version of virus signature > database 8577 (20130717) __________ > > The message was checked by ESET Smart Security. > > http://www.eset.com > > _______________________________________________ > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo > From johnbrewerphotography at gmail.com Wed Jul 17 17:04:45 2013 From: johnbrewerphotography at gmail.com (John Brewer) Date: Wed, 17 Jul 2013 18:04:45 +0100 Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: A DEFINITIVE ANSWER? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3E696497-778D-45F0-9903-FEFC8D52CBDC@gmail.com> Hi Bob I expect it could be done but I'm not sure what control you would have. Additionally it would liberate chlorine gas which is toxic. Best John Sent from my iPhone On 17 Jul 2013, at 16:31, "BOB KISS" wrote: > DEAR LIST, > > Can I or can I not bleach (even slightly) a print made mostly of > palladium? I have a print made of 95% palladium and it is a bit dark. > > 1) Most books on pt/pd printing warn against using HCl as the first > clearing bath with palladium prints because it can bleach them. > > 2) Don Bryant posted Michael Mutmansky?s procedure for bleaching out black > spots on pt/pd prints by first placing some dilute HCl on the spot and then > some dilute chlorine bleach on the same spot. Might this work on a macro > scale by first immersing a print in the dilute HCl then into the dilute > bleach? > > 3) But, on the other hand, some people say that it is impossible to bleach > up a dark palladium print. > > Am I the only one who finds this contradictory? > > Soooooooooooooooooooooo, has anyone had success slightly > bleaching up a dark palladium print? Or does this sound feasible? > > Of course I am making another lighter print but is there any way not to > waste the dark one? > > > CHEERS! > > > BOB > > > > Please check my website: http://www.bobkiss.com/ > > > > > "Live as if you are going to die tomorrow. Learn as if you are going to > live forever". Mahatma Gandhi > > > > "Earth" without "art" is just "Eh"! (Anonymous graffiti posted on Facebook) > > > > ?Madonne e fiori, trionfo eterno di giovent?!? from Mattinata Fiorentina by > Antonella Ruggiero > > > > > > > > __________ Information from ESET Smart Security, version of virus signature > database 8577 (20130717) __________ > > The message was checked by ESET Smart Security. > > http://www.eset.com > > _______________________________________________ > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo From ejnphoto at sbcglobal.net Thu Jul 18 20:21:13 2013 From: ejnphoto at sbcglobal.net (Eric Neilsen) Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2013 15:21:13 -0500 Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: A DEFINITIVE ANSWER? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <005701ce83f4$59f54c30$0ddfe490$@net> A brighter light bulb.... : ) Eric Neilsen 4101 Commerce Street, Suite 9 Dallas, TX 75226 214-827-8301 www.ericneilsenphotography.com SKYPE ejprinter -----Original Message----- From: alt-photo-process-list-bounces at lists.altphotolist.org [mailto:alt-photo-process-list-bounces at lists.altphotolist.org] On Behalf Of BOB KISS Sent: Wednesday, July 17, 2013 10:31 AM To: alt-photo-process-list at lists.altphotolist.org Subject: [Alt-photo] A DEFINITIVE ANSWER? DEAR LIST, Can I or can I not bleach (even slightly) a print made mostly of palladium? I have a print made of 95% palladium and it is a bit dark. 1) Most books on pt/pd printing warn against using HCl as the first clearing bath with palladium prints because it can bleach them. 2) Don Bryant posted Michael Mutmansky?s procedure for bleaching out black spots on pt/pd prints by first placing some dilute HCl on the spot and then some dilute chlorine bleach on the same spot. Might this work on a macro scale by first immersing a print in the dilute HCl then into the dilute bleach? 3) But, on the other hand, some people say that it is impossible to bleach up a dark palladium print. Am I the only one who finds this contradictory? Soooooooooooooooooooooo, has anyone had success slightly bleaching up a dark palladium print? Or does this sound feasible? Of course I am making another lighter print but is there any way not to waste the dark one? CHEERS! BOB Please check my website: http://www.bobkiss.com/ "Live as if you are going to die tomorrow. Learn as if you are going to live forever". Mahatma Gandhi "Earth" without "art" is just "Eh"! (Anonymous graffiti posted on Facebook) ?Madonne e fiori, trionfo eterno di giovent?!? from Mattinata Fiorentina by Antonella Ruggiero __________ Information from ESET Smart Security, version of virus signature database 8577 (20130717) __________ The message was checked by ESET Smart Security. http://www.eset.com _______________________________________________ Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo From dlhbloomfield at gmail.com Thu Jul 18 20:50:13 2013 From: dlhbloomfield at gmail.com (Diana Bloomfield) Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2013 16:50:13 -0400 Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: A DEFINITIVE ANSWER? In-Reply-To: <005701ce83f4$59f54c30$0ddfe490$@net> References: <005701ce83f4$59f54c30$0ddfe490$@net> Message-ID: <63C4E88B-5F83-4027-8225-06D41B399229@gmail.com> You could always use the darker one, and write up some esoteric reasoning for why you preferred and ultimately chose ('preferred' and 'chose' being the key words here) to print the image so dark. That's probably what I would do. And then I'd get a brighter light bulb. :) You probably could do some weird bleaching, but you'd get a less than desirable, uneven, grainy print from it (I'm guessing). Just bite the bullet, and re-print it. Another option might be to add a gum layer to it. I'm not sure it would actually brighten it, but a layer of a warm golden pigment, for instance, might make it more interesting and give it a look that is more desirable. And then write an esoteric piece about that. So-- yes-- all in all, I'd go with the esoteric reasoning no matter what you decide to do. And if you make it as indecipherable as possible, who can argue with that? Diana On Jul 18, 2013, at 4:21 PM, Eric Neilsen wrote: > A brighter light bulb.... : ) > > Eric Neilsen > 4101 Commerce Street, Suite 9 > Dallas, TX 75226 > 214-827-8301 > > www.ericneilsenphotography.com > SKYPE ejprinter > > -----Original Message----- > From: alt-photo-process-list-bounces at lists.altphotolist.org > [mailto:alt-photo-process-list-bounces at lists.altphotolist.org] On Behalf Of > BOB KISS > Sent: Wednesday, July 17, 2013 10:31 AM > To: alt-photo-process-list at lists.altphotolist.org > Subject: [Alt-photo] A DEFINITIVE ANSWER? > > DEAR LIST, > > Can I or can I not bleach (even slightly) a print made mostly of > palladium? I have a print made of 95% palladium and it is a bit dark. > > 1) Most books on pt/pd printing warn against using HCl as the first > clearing bath with palladium prints because it can bleach them. > > 2) Don Bryant posted Michael Mutmansky?s procedure for bleaching out black > spots on pt/pd prints by first placing some dilute HCl on the spot and then > some dilute chlorine bleach on the same spot. Might this work on a macro > scale by first immersing a print in the dilute HCl then into the dilute > bleach? > > 3) But, on the other hand, some people say that it is impossible to bleach > up a dark palladium print. > > Am I the only one who finds this contradictory? > > Soooooooooooooooooooooo, has anyone had success slightly > bleaching up a dark palladium print? Or does this sound feasible? > > Of course I am making another lighter print but is there any way not to > waste the dark one? > > > CHEERS! > > > BOB > > > > Please check my website: http://www.bobkiss.com/ > > > > > "Live as if you are going to die tomorrow. Learn as if you are going to > live forever". Mahatma Gandhi > > > > "Earth" without "art" is just "Eh"! (Anonymous graffiti posted on Facebook) > > > > ?Madonne e fiori, trionfo eterno di giovent?!? from Mattinata Fiorentina by > Antonella Ruggiero > > > > > > > > __________ Information from ESET Smart Security, version of virus signature > database 8577 (20130717) __________ > > The message was checked by ESET Smart Security. > > http://www.eset.com > > _______________________________________________ > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo > > _______________________________________________ > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo From bobkiss at caribsurf.com Thu Jul 18 23:10:59 2013 From: bobkiss at caribsurf.com (BOB KISS) Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2013 19:10:59 -0400 Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: A DEFINITIVE ANSWER? In-Reply-To: <63C4E88B-5F83-4027-8225-06D41B399229@gmail.com> References: <005701ce83f4$59f54c30$0ddfe490$@net> <63C4E88B-5F83-4027-8225-06D41B399229@gmail.com> Message-ID: DEAR DIANA & ERIC, As mentioned in my original e-mail *I did make a lighter print* but it seems a shame to toss out a 20X24 palladium print that would be easily correctible with a subtle bleaching if it were a silver gelatin. Further, I believed Ansel Adams when he said, making a musical analogy, ?The negative is the score. The print is the performance!? Like most performing musicians who "shape" (volume and equalization) their sound to the size and acoustics of the hall in which they will be performing, I try to fine tune the tonality of my prints according to the type of lighting under which they will be shown and viewed. I have a track light set up to view my dry prints that will be shown in galleries with spotlighting. I also ask the collectors who buy my prints what lighting will be on the prints in the rooms where they intend to hang them. The differences are not enormous; they are subtle, but most of you on this list would see them and the prints do sing when printed for the specific lighting. So the "brighter light" theory doesn't work here. Earlier today I received an e-mail suggesting that HBr, hydrobromic acid, does work as a mild reducing agent for palladium. The trick is finding this on this little island called Barbados. If I can find some and try reducing this print I will report results. The other option Is to cut it up and use it to test new toners and new surface waxes. Living here one learns to waste as little as possible. CHEERS! BOB -----Original Message----- From: alt-photo-process-list-bounces at lists.altphotolist.org [mailto:alt-photo-process-list-bounces at lists.altphotolist.org] On Behalf Of Diana Bloomfield Sent: Thursday, July 18, 2013 4:50 PM To: alt-photo-process-list at lists.altphotolist.org Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: A DEFINITIVE ANSWER? You could always use the darker one, and write up some esoteric reasoning for why you preferred and ultimately chose ('preferred' and 'chose' being the key words here) to print the image so dark. That's probably what I would do. And then I'd get a brighter light bulb. :) You probably could do some weird bleaching, but you'd get a less than desirable, uneven, grainy print from it (I'm guessing). Just bite the bullet, and re-print it. Another option might be to add a gum layer to it. I'm not sure it would actually brighten it, but a layer of a warm golden pigment, for instance, might make it more interesting and give it a look that is more desirable. And then write an esoteric piece about that. So-- yes-- all in all, I'd go with the esoteric reasoning no matter what you decide to do. And if you make it as indecipherable as possible, who can argue with that? Diana On Jul 18, 2013, at 4:21 PM, Eric Neilsen wrote: > A brighter light bulb.... : ) > > Eric Neilsen > 4101 Commerce Street, Suite 9 > Dallas, TX 75226 > 214-827-8301 > > www.ericneilsenphotography.com > SKYPE ejprinter > > -----Original Message----- > From: alt-photo-process-list-bounces at lists.altphotolist.org > [mailto:alt-photo-process-list-bounces at lists.altphotolist.org] On Behalf Of > BOB KISS > Sent: Wednesday, July 17, 2013 10:31 AM > To: alt-photo-process-list at lists.altphotolist.org > Subject: [Alt-photo] A DEFINITIVE ANSWER? > > DEAR LIST, > > Can I or can I not bleach (even slightly) a print made mostly of > palladium? I have a print made of 95% palladium and it is a bit dark. > > 1) Most books on pt/pd printing warn against using HCl as the first > clearing bath with palladium prints because it can bleach them. > > 2) Don Bryant posted Michael Mutmansky?s procedure for bleaching out black > spots on pt/pd prints by first placing some dilute HCl on the spot and then > some dilute chlorine bleach on the same spot. Might this work on a macro > scale by first immersing a print in the dilute HCl then into the dilute > bleach? > > 3) But, on the other hand, some people say that it is impossible to bleach > up a dark palladium print. > > Am I the only one who finds this contradictory? > > Soooooooooooooooooooooo, has anyone had success slightly > bleaching up a dark palladium print? Or does this sound feasible? > > Of course I am making another lighter print but is there any way not to > waste the dark one? > > > CHEERS! > > > BOB > > > > Please check my website: http://www.bobkiss.com/ > > > > > "Live as if you are going to die tomorrow. Learn as if you are going to > live forever". Mahatma Gandhi > > > > "Earth" without "art" is just "Eh"! (Anonymous graffiti posted on Facebook) > > > > ?Madonne e fiori, trionfo eterno di giovent?!? from Mattinata Fiorentina by > Antonella Ruggiero > > > > > > > > __________ Information from ESET Smart Security, version of virus signature > database 8577 (20130717) __________ > > The message was checked by ESET Smart Security. > > http://www.eset.com > > _______________________________________________ > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo > > _______________________________________________ > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo _______________________________________________ Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo __________ Information from ESET Smart Security, version of virus signature database 8583 (20130718) __________ The message was checked by ESET Smart Security. http://www.eset.com From dlhbloomfield at gmail.com Thu Jul 18 23:41:08 2013 From: dlhbloomfield at gmail.com (Diana Bloomfield) Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2013 19:41:08 -0400 Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: A DEFINITIVE ANSWER? In-Reply-To: References: <005701ce83f4$59f54c30$0ddfe490$@net> <63C4E88B-5F83-4027-8225-06D41B399229@gmail.com> Message-ID: <3B63CBCA-BEFB-495B-A8FE-D46F01BA787F@gmail.com> Hi Bob, I've obviously never bleached a pt/pd print, but I am guessing that it might be difficult to get an even tonality, and you might also lose some smoothness. But I could be wrong. If I wanted to know how to do it, though, I would not try it on an otherwise acceptable 20x24 print. I also would not throw out the print. I'd keep it, and just consider it a darker version. If every alt process print came out looking exactly the same, with no differences-- I would be shocked and a bit disappointed. At that point, you may as well just make a few digital prints and embrace the sameness. Diana On Jul 18, 2013, at 7:10 PM, BOB KISS wrote: > DEAR DIANA & ERIC, > As mentioned in my original e-mail *I did make a lighter print* but > it seems a shame to toss out a 20X24 palladium print that would be easily > correctible with a subtle bleaching if it were a silver gelatin. > Further, I believed Ansel Adams when he said, making a musical > analogy, ?The negative is the score. The print is the performance!? Like > most performing musicians who "shape" (volume and equalization) their sound > to the size and acoustics of the hall in which they will be performing, I > try to fine tune the tonality of my prints according to the type of lighting > under which they will be shown and viewed. I have a track light set up to > view my dry prints that will be shown in galleries with spotlighting. I > also ask the collectors who buy my prints what lighting will be on the > prints in the rooms where they intend to hang them. The differences are not > enormous; they are subtle, but most of you on this list would see them and > the prints do sing when printed for the specific lighting. So the "brighter > light" theory doesn't work here. > Earlier today I received an e-mail suggesting that HBr, hydrobromic > acid, does work as a mild reducing agent for palladium. The trick is > finding this on this little island called Barbados. If I can find some and > try reducing this print I will report results. The other option Is to cut > it up and use it to test new toners and new surface waxes. Living here one > learns to waste as little as possible. > CHEERS! > BOB > From krd at photoartsimaging.com Thu Jul 18 23:41:41 2013 From: krd at photoartsimaging.com (Kim Du Boise) Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2013 18:41:41 -0500 Subject: [Alt-photo] A DEFINITIVE ANSWER? Message-ID: <777B169D-7777-49B6-B534-82C98E269B17@photoartsimaging.com> Hi Bob and everyone, If you want to do the larger tray bath, PLEASE do it outside with the breeze blowing away from you?and wear something that will resemble a respirator for the gas! Chlorine gas is nothing to sneeze at (pardon the pun), and we don't need to lose any of our talented folks. We use (& work with) so many chemicals & combinations, and may not feel the effects of mis-handling or tight areas for years, but one day it may hurt you or cause an allergic reaction. So be careful, please. Also, you should thoroughly wash the prints to get the paper back to it's stable pH, or as close as possible. These bleaches, like the Farmer's reducer, can weaken the paper fibers if left in. As a conservator, we work with a variety of media from ambrotypes to modern prints/films and now digital files and printing materials. If one doesn't know what each process uses or contains, you can ruin a print, negative or positive. The idea of finding an equivalent compound to potassium ferricyanide for pt/pd is intriguing. If someone wants to send scraps (& I do mean scraps or scrapped pieces of images) that we can test with various solutions, I will try to work on it. If someone has already started or tried this, please send me info as a starting point & why it did not work. I would need to have enough to cut into at least half or more sections to test out solution strengths. I will even try with dark spots. Just let me know the number of coatings, sized or not, and any other information you feel is relevant to investigation. Scraps will be cut & examined to see how deeply the emulsion goes into the paper; it may be too deep to bleach well. If anyone wants to try this, I am game and will post anything we find out (good or not) for all to see. Just remember, we are a conservation lab and this is my day job?so it may be that this will take a bit of time to get info back to the list. All the best, Kim Kim R. Du Boise, P. A. - AIC Senior Conservator PhotoArts Imaging Professionals, LLC 123 Buchanan Road Hattiesburg, MS 39401-9545 Local: 601-582-3686 FAX: 601-544-1920 Toll-free: 866-278-3686 www.photoartsimaging.com From keith.gerling at gmail.com Fri Jul 19 01:21:59 2013 From: keith.gerling at gmail.com (Keith Gerling) Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2013 20:21:59 -0500 Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: A DEFINITIVE ANSWER? In-Reply-To: <3B63CBCA-BEFB-495B-A8FE-D46F01BA787F@gmail.com> References: <005701ce83f4$59f54c30$0ddfe490$@net> <63C4E88B-5F83-4027-8225-06D41B399229@gmail.com> <3B63CBCA-BEFB-495B-A8FE-D46F01BA787F@gmail.com> Message-ID: If you have an emotional attachment to this dark print and want to save it at the cost of some extra (plenty extra!) work, you might want to consider "lightening it up" with a layer of white gum exposed though a positive. It won't be the same as a properly exposed pt/pd, but it might be better. On Thu, Jul 18, 2013 at 6:41 PM, Diana Bloomfield wrote: > Hi Bob, > > I've obviously never bleached a pt/pd print, but I am guessing that it > might be difficult to get an even tonality, and you might also lose some > smoothness. But I could be wrong. If I wanted to know how to do it, > though, I would not try it on an otherwise acceptable 20x24 print. I also > would not throw out the print. I'd keep it, and just consider it a darker > version. If every alt process print came out looking exactly the same, > with no differences-- I would be shocked and a bit disappointed. At that > point, you may as well just make a few digital prints and embrace the > sameness. > > Diana > > > On Jul 18, 2013, at 7:10 PM, BOB KISS wrote: > > > DEAR DIANA & ERIC, > > As mentioned in my original e-mail *I did make a lighter print* but > > it seems a shame to toss out a 20X24 palladium print that would be easily > > correctible with a subtle bleaching if it were a silver gelatin. > > Further, I believed Ansel Adams when he said, making a musical > > analogy, ?The negative is the score. The print is the performance!? > Like > > most performing musicians who "shape" (volume and equalization) their > sound > > to the size and acoustics of the hall in which they will be performing, I > > try to fine tune the tonality of my prints according to the type of > lighting > > under which they will be shown and viewed. I have a track light set up > to > > view my dry prints that will be shown in galleries with spotlighting. I > > also ask the collectors who buy my prints what lighting will be on the > > prints in the rooms where they intend to hang them. The differences are > not > > enormous; they are subtle, but most of you on this list would see them > and > > the prints do sing when printed for the specific lighting. So the > "brighter > > light" theory doesn't work here. > > Earlier today I received an e-mail suggesting that HBr, hydrobromic > > acid, does work as a mild reducing agent for palladium. The trick is > > finding this on this little island called Barbados. If I can find some > and > > try reducing this print I will report results. The other option Is to > cut > > it up and use it to test new toners and new surface waxes. Living here > one > > learns to waste as little as possible. > > CHEERS! > > BOB > > > _______________________________________________ > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo > From clay at clayharmon.com Fri Jul 19 12:47:34 2013 From: clay at clayharmon.com (clay harmon's personal website email account) Date: Fri, 19 Jul 2013 08:47:34 -0400 Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: A DEFINITIVE ANSWER? In-Reply-To: References: <005701ce83f4$59f54c30$0ddfe490$@net> <63C4E88B-5F83-4027-8225-06D41B399229@gmail.com> <3B63CBCA-BEFB-495B-A8FE-D46F01BA787F@gmail.com> Message-ID: <0F49373F-7537-4080-8813-B33AB9532EF3@clayharmon.com> If the print is primarily palladium, just leaving it for 15-60 minutes in a tray of hypo-clear can bleach the print. I have seen this first hand after accidentally forgetting to move a print in the last clearing bath to my rinse tray. I'm not sure how controllable this is, but I have talked to others who have seen this effect. Clay Sent using 100% all-natural biodynamic electrons On Jul 18, 2013, at 9:21 PM, Keith Gerling wrote: > If you have an emotional attachment to this dark print and want to save it > at the cost of some extra (plenty extra!) work, you might want to consider > "lightening it up" with a layer of white gum exposed though a positive. It > won't be the same as a properly exposed pt/pd, but it might be better. > > > On Thu, Jul 18, 2013 at 6:41 PM, Diana Bloomfield > wrote: > >> Hi Bob, >> >> I've obviously never bleached a pt/pd print, but I am guessing that it >> might be difficult to get an even tonality, and you might also lose some >> smoothness. But I could be wrong. If I wanted to know how to do it, >> though, I would not try it on an otherwise acceptable 20x24 print. I also >> would not throw out the print. I'd keep it, and just consider it a darker >> version. If every alt process print came out looking exactly the same, >> with no differences-- I would be shocked and a bit disappointed. At that >> point, you may as well just make a few digital prints and embrace the >> sameness. >> >> Diana >> >> >> On Jul 18, 2013, at 7:10 PM, BOB KISS wrote: >> >>> DEAR DIANA & ERIC, >>> As mentioned in my original e-mail *I did make a lighter print* but >>> it seems a shame to toss out a 20X24 palladium print that would be easily >>> correctible with a subtle bleaching if it were a silver gelatin. >>> Further, I believed Ansel Adams when he said, making a musical >>> analogy, ?The negative is the score. The print is the performance!? >> Like >>> most performing musicians who "shape" (volume and equalization) their >> sound >>> to the size and acoustics of the hall in which they will be performing, I >>> try to fine tune the tonality of my prints according to the type of >> lighting >>> under which they will be shown and viewed. I have a track light set up >> to >>> view my dry prints that will be shown in galleries with spotlighting. I >>> also ask the collectors who buy my prints what lighting will be on the >>> prints in the rooms where they intend to hang them. The differences are >> not >>> enormous; they are subtle, but most of you on this list would see them >> and >>> the prints do sing when printed for the specific lighting. So the >> "brighter >>> light" theory doesn't work here. >>> Earlier today I received an e-mail suggesting that HBr, hydrobromic >>> acid, does work as a mild reducing agent for palladium. The trick is >>> finding this on this little island called Barbados. If I can find some >> and >>> try reducing this print I will report results. The other option Is to >> cut >>> it up and use it to test new toners and new surface waxes. Living here >> one >>> learns to waste as little as possible. >>> CHEERS! >>> BOB >> _______________________________________________ >> Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo > _______________________________________________ > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo From bobkiss at caribsurf.com Fri Jul 19 19:47:53 2013 From: bobkiss at caribsurf.com (KISS BOB) Date: Fri, 19 Jul 2013 15:47:53 -0400 Subject: [Alt-photo] ANOTHER OFF TOPIC Q" PHOTO GALLERIES WILMINGTON NC In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: DEAR LIST, Does anyone on this list know of a gallery in Wilmington NC that sells photography, especially fine art photography? CHEERS! BOB From marekmatusz at hotmail.com Sat Jul 20 18:32:42 2013 From: marekmatusz at hotmail.com (Marek Matusz) Date: Sat, 20 Jul 2013 18:32:42 +0000 Subject: [Alt-photo] Cadmium yellow In-Reply-To: References: , <005701ce83f4$59f54c30$0ddfe490$@net>, <63C4E88B-5F83-4027-8225-06D41B399229@gmail.com>, , <3B63CBCA-BEFB-495B-A8FE-D46F01BA787F@gmail.com>, Message-ID: Bob, This is an example of opaque yellow, cadmium yellow used on the highlighs. I was not very happy with transparent yellows and decided to use a thin layer of opaque yellow on top (as a last layer). It is amazing how it opened the colour. This is a bad picture, my big camera is out of service, but it illustrates the point. The cad yellow was applied locally and exposed through a B negative. You could do something like this and exposed through positive as you would want this opaque layer to affect highlights only. As somebody suggested to use white in this scenario, but you can be even more creative. Here is the link to my picture https://plus.google.com/photos/105732508998271877151/albums/5882305049320410433 I am using this cadmium yellow on a couple more prints as we speak. Marek From marekmatusz at hotmail.com Sun Jul 21 01:20:14 2013 From: marekmatusz at hotmail.com (Marek Matusz) Date: Sun, 21 Jul 2013 01:20:14 +0000 Subject: [Alt-photo] Palladium bleach In-Reply-To: References: , <005701ce83f4$59f54c30$0ddfe490$@net>, <63C4E88B-5F83-4027-8225-06D41B399229@gmail.com>, Message-ID: Bob This is an approximate recipe that I have used. I actually do not measure it carefully. Add to 1 liter of water: about 20 cc of 12% K2Cr2O7 solution, followed by about 2 grams of KBr, followed by about 10 cc of concentrated sulfuric acid (be careful as addition of concentrated sulfuric acid could cause local heating or boling). Bath to be used outside or with good ventilation as likely it involves bromine as a reactive agent. Use gloves and goggles, and handle all chemicals with care. Per-wet your print and immerse in the solution. Bleaching should follow in 2-5 minutes, rinse with water and follow with a bath of sulfite or metabisulfite to remove (neutralize) any residual oxidizers. Marek From remko at degraaff.biz Sun Jul 21 08:40:55 2013 From: remko at degraaff.biz (remko) Date: Sun, 21 Jul 2013 10:40:55 +0200 Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: Cadmium yellow In-Reply-To: References: , <005701ce83f4$59f54c30$0ddfe490$@net>, <63C4E88B-5F83-4027-8225-06D41B399229@gmail.com>, , <3B63CBCA-BEFB-495B-A8FE-D46F01BA787F@gmail.com>, Message-ID: <51EB9E97.4020809@degraaff.biz> Marek, could you please explain what you mean by the "B negative" is it the negative from the B being the Yellow negative or is it the B negative meaning the Blue or Cyaan negative Op 20-7-2013 20:32, Marek Matusz schreef: > > Bob, This is an example of opaque yellow, cadmium yellow used on the highlighs. I was not very happy with transparent yellows and decided to use a thin layer of opaque yellow on top (as a last layer). It is amazing how it opened the colour. This is a bad picture, my big camera is out of service, but it illustrates the point. The cad yellow was applied locally and exposed through a B negative. You could do something like this and exposed through positive as you would want this opaque layer to affect highlights only. As somebody suggested to use white in this scenario, but you can be even more creative. Here is the link to my picture https://plus.google.com/photos/105732508998271877151/albums/5882305049320410433 I am using this cadmium yellow on a couple more prints as we speak. Marek > _______________________________________________ > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo > > From bobkiss at caribsurf.com Sun Jul 21 09:47:12 2013 From: bobkiss at caribsurf.com (KISS BOB) Date: Sun, 21 Jul 2013 05:47:12 -0400 Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: Palladium bleach In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: DEAR MAREK, Thanks for this procedure. I have these ingredients which makes this more practical than trying to find (or import) hydrobromic acid here in Barbados. I will give it a try and report results but this might take some time as I am working flat out on a large print order. THANKS! CHEERS! BOB On Sun, 21 Jul 2013 01:20:14 +0000 Marek Matusz wrote: > > > Bob This is an approximate recipe that I have used. I >actually do not measure it carefully. Add to 1 liter of >water: about 20 cc of 12% K2Cr2O7 solution, followed by >about 2 grams of KBr, followed by about 10 cc of >concentrated sulfuric acid (be careful as addition of >concentrated sulfuric acid could cause local heating or >boling). Bath to be used outside or with good ventilation >as likely it involves bromine as a reactive agent. Use >gloves and goggles, and handle all chemicals with care. >Per-wet your print and immerse in the solution. Bleaching >should follow in 2-5 minutes, rinse with water and follow >with a bath of sulfite or metabisulfite to remove >(neutralize) any residual oxidizers. Marek > _______________________________________________ > Alt-photo-process-list | >lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo From marekmatusz at hotmail.com Sun Jul 21 13:50:10 2013 From: marekmatusz at hotmail.com (Marek Matusz) Date: Sun, 21 Jul 2013 08:50:10 -0500 Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: Cadmium yellow In-Reply-To: <51EB9E97.4020809@degraaff.biz> References: <005701ce83f4$59f54c30$0ddfe490$@net> <63C4E88B-5F83-4027-8225-06D41B399229@gmail.com> <3B63CBCA-BEFB-495B-A8FE-D46F01BA787F@gmail.com> <51EB9E97.4020809@degraaff.biz> Message-ID: I split my negatives into RGB in photoshop R is printed with cyan pigment. G with magenta and B with yellow pigment. Sent from my iPhone On Jul 21, 2013, at 3:40 AM, "remko" wrote: > Marek, could you please explain what you mean by the "B negative" > > is it the negative from the B being the Yellow negative or is it > > the B negative meaning the Blue or Cyaan negative > > Op 20-7-2013 20:32, Marek Matusz schreef: >> Bob, This is an example of opaque yellow, cadmium yellow used on the highlighs. I was not very happy with transparent yellows and decided to use a thin layer of opaque yellow on top (as a last layer). It is amazing how it opened the colour. This is a bad picture, my big camera is out of service, but it illustrates the point. The cad yellow was applied locally and exposed through a B negative. You could do something like this and exposed through positive as you would want this opaque layer to affect highlights only. As somebody suggested to use white in this scenario, but you can be even more creative. Here is the link to my picture https://plus.google.com/photos/105732508998271877151/albums/5882305049320410433 I am using this cadmium yellow on a couple more prints as we speak. Marek >> _______________________________________________ >> Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo > > _______________________________________________ > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo From marekmatusz at hotmail.com Sun Jul 21 15:05:46 2013 From: marekmatusz at hotmail.com (Marek Matusz) Date: Sun, 21 Jul 2013 10:05:46 -0500 Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: Palladium bleach In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: One more thing. The ingredients of this reducer keep reacting with each other so it should be made fresh and discarded after use. I would not recommend storing it Marek Sent from my iPhone On Jul 21, 2013, at 4:47 AM, "KISS BOB" wrote: > DEAR MAREK, > Thanks for this procedure. I have these ingredients which makes this more practical than trying to find (or import) hydrobromic acid here in Barbados. > I will give it a try and report results but this might take some time as I am working flat out on a large print order. > THANKS! > CHEERS! > BOB > > > On Sun, 21 Jul 2013 01:20:14 +0000 > Marek Matusz wrote: >> Bob This is an approximate recipe that I have used. I actually do not measure it carefully. Add to 1 liter of water: about 20 cc of 12% K2Cr2O7 solution, followed by about 2 grams of KBr, followed by about 10 cc of concentrated sulfuric acid (be careful as addition of concentrated sulfuric acid could cause local heating or boling). Bath to be used outside or with good ventilation as likely it involves bromine as a reactive agent. Use gloves and goggles, and handle all chemicals with care. Per-wet your print and immerse in the solution. Bleaching should follow in 2-5 minutes, rinse with water and follow with a bath of sulfite or metabisulfite to remove (neutralize) any residual oxidizers. Marek _______________________________________________ >> Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo > > _______________________________________________ > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo From bobkiss at caribsurf.com Sun Jul 21 17:36:23 2013 From: bobkiss at caribsurf.com (KISS BOB) Date: Sun, 21 Jul 2013 13:36:23 -0400 Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: Palladium bleach In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: DEAR MAREK, I do that for all reducers and toners...mix the working solution and dump after use but thanks for the instructions. Looking forward to trying it when I have some free time. CHEERS! BOB On Sun, 21 Jul 2013 10:05:46 -0500 Marek Matusz wrote: > One more thing. The ingredients of this reducer keep >reacting with each other so it should be made fresh and >discarded after use. I would not recommend storing it > Marek > Sent from my iPhone > > On Jul 21, 2013, at 4:47 AM, "KISS BOB" > wrote: > >> DEAR MAREK, >> Thanks for this procedure. I have these ingredients >>which makes this more practical than trying to find (or >>import) hydrobromic acid here in Barbados. >> I will give it a try and report results but this >>might take some time as I am working flat out on a large >>print order. >> THANKS! >> CHEERS! >> BOB >> >> >> On Sun, 21 Jul 2013 01:20:14 +0000 >> Marek Matusz wrote: >>> Bob This is an approximate recipe that I have used. I >>>actually do not measure it carefully. Add to 1 liter of >>>water: about 20 cc of 12% K2Cr2O7 solution, followed by >>>about 2 grams of KBr, followed by about 10 cc of >>>concentrated sulfuric acid (be careful as addition of >>>concentrated sulfuric acid could cause local heating or >>>boling). Bath to be used outside or with good ventilation >>>as likely it involves bromine as a reactive agent. Use >>>gloves and goggles, and handle all chemicals with care. >>>Per-wet your print and immerse in the solution. Bleaching >>>should follow in 2-5 minutes, rinse with water and follow >>>with a bath of sulfite or metabisulfite to remove >>>(neutralize) any residual oxidizers. Marek >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Alt-photo-process-list | >>>lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Alt-photo-process-list | >>lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo > _______________________________________________ > Alt-photo-process-list | >lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo From robert.g.hall at gmail.com Thu Jul 25 17:16:10 2013 From: robert.g.hall at gmail.com (Robert Hall) Date: Thu, 25 Jul 2013 11:16:10 -0600 Subject: [Alt-photo] Re: VERDICT ON FUMED SILICA? In-Reply-To: <93DB88FD-79D3-4C52-A094-5D262E984364@clayharmon.com> References: <93DB88FD-79D3-4C52-A094-5D262E984364@clayharmon.com> Message-ID: As long as I coat the paper evenly, the print certainly has better contrast and d-max. Robert Hall www.RobertHall.com www.RobertHall.com/workshops www.facebook.com/robert.g.hall On Thu, May 30, 2013 at 1:59 PM, clay harmon's personal website email account wrote: > I've been using sulfamic for buffer neutralization on my palladium prints > for the last month. It works very well, even on heavily buffered papers > like Fabriano Extra White. I am getting measured Dmax values of 1.4 or > better on all the papers I have tried so far (Rives BFK, Twinrocker, > Moulin de Gue and Whatman's Printmaker). I am not as happy with it as the > only clearing agent - I seem to still have some residual ferric oxalate in > the paper if sulfamic acid is the only clearing agent I use. But a regimen > of a first bath of disodium EDTA followed by two baths of Hypoclear with > Tetrasodium EDTA added to it seems to work extremely well. > > My experience with fumed silica has been mixed. It works very well on some > papers (twinrocker in particular), but not as well on others. I am getting > richer prints on Fabriano Extra White using the sulfamic acid approach than > when I used the fumed silica. > > -Clay > On May 30, 2013, at 3:00 PM, "BOB KISS" wrote: > > > DEAR LIST, > > > > Is the jury in with a final verdict on using fumed silica to > > increase Dmax of pt/pd prints? > > > > *****And now, the Touchstone question: How many of you actually use it > when > > you print pt/pd (or any other alt processes)? > > > > > > CHEERS! > > > > > > BOB > > > > > > > > Please check my website: > http://www.bobkiss.com/ > > > > > > > > > > "Live as if you are going to die tomorrow. Learn as if you are going to > > live forever". Mahatma Gandhi > > > > > > > > "Earth" without "art" is just "Eh"! (Anonymous graffiti posted on > Facebook) > > > > > > > > ?Madonne e fiori, trionfo eterno di giovent?!? from Mattinata > Fiorentina by > > Antonella Ruggiero > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________ Information from ESET Smart Security, version of virus > signature > > database 8394 (20130530) __________ > > > > The message was checked by ESET Smart Security. > > > > http://www.eset.com > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo > > _______________________________________________ > Alt-photo-process-list | lists.altphotolist.org/mailman/listinfo >