From: ken watson (watsok@frii.com)
Date: 01/14/02-02:08:55 PM Z
Sandy,
I write from a point that I only "remember" Watkins prints not exhibiting
any yellowing. My viewing them at the time was to look closely for how they
were made and to see what artifacts were present from the wet plate process.
I must say that they were mostly trimmed to eliminate evidence of this
process and Watkin's prints were very good. Muybridge is another
discussion.
I do offer an alternative to the comment that sulfur is responsible ( from
the fixer ) and that albumen has a great affinity for silver. In the 1860's
Cyanide was used for fixing negatives ( glass plates ) , and why not prints?
This would leave no fixer ( sulfur based at least ) in the albumen and
cyanide has a much greater affinity for silver than Hypo. I think it is
reasonable that some artist's or their printers fixed their work this way.
Why have MORE chemicals than necessary to complicate an already complicated
process and supply chain?.
Sorry, no proof of this. If I owned a nice print it might be worth while to
take a sample and have it analyzed for cyanide residue.
..-----Original Message-----
..From: Sandy King [mailto:sanking@CLEMSON.EDU]
..Sent: Monday, January 14, 2002 11:18 AM
..To: alt-photo-process-l@skyway.usask.ca
..Subject: RE: Albumen - How Archival
..
..
..Ken,
..
..My understanding of both the mechanism of yellowing of albumen
..prints, and of its long-term consequences, is that it is both
..different and more serious than recent messages by you and Michael
..Steinle would suggest. What I know is based largely on James Reilly's
..book, The Albumen and Salted Paper Book, so if you know other
..authoritative sources which may cast new light on the issues involved
..I would like to know them. I quote two particularly significant
..passages form Reilly (available at
..http://albumen.stanford.edu/library/monographs/reilly/chap11.html).
..
..First, on the cause of yellowing.
..
.."The probable origin of the yellowing phenomenon in albumen paper is
..the chemical bonding of silver to sulfur-containing side groups on
..the protein molecules of albumen, some of which have a very high
..affinity for silver. The silver bonded during sensitization to these
..sites on the protein is so tightly held that treatment in hypo is not
..sufficient to remove it. Thus a small amount of silver remains in all
..areas of a fixed albumen print; the conversion of this silver to
..silver sulfide is the immediate cause of the yellowing phenomenon."
..
..Since historical prints made by other processes do not generally
..exhibit this type of yellowing it is probably safe to assume that it
..is limited to albumen prints, and/or other prints with a substrate
..that consists in part of whole of albumen.
..
..Second, on the severity of the problem, Reilly write:
..
.."On the other hand the imperceptibly slow fading process and staining
..of the highlights in historical albumen prints may be proceeding at a
..rate which will lead to very severe image deterioration long
..deteriorate. What this means is that possibly in another 75 years,
..not a single albumen print will at all resemble its original
..appearance."
..
..I am truly very happy to know that some of Watkins' prints of
..Yosemite from the 1860s have survived so well. However, I don't
..believe one can be certain that these prints have not already
..yellowed significantly, or that they will not do so in time unless
..some remedy can be found to reverse or stop a reaction which appears
..to happen with almost 100% of albumen prints.
..
..
..Sandy King
..
..
..
..
..
..
..
..
..
..>Sandy,
..>
..>I have seen orginal Watkins prints of Yosemite that are neither yellow or
..>cracked. Since these are the oldest prints , with the exception
..of salt, in
..>the world I think this is our best example. The salt prints that I have
..>seen, only pictures of them, ...now they seem faded or worse. Most likely
..>due to poor fixing I would suspect. This of course leaves out tintypes,
..>ambrotypes and Dags which are all doing well. Once again most
..likely due to
..>their substrates.
..>
..>..-----Original Message-----
..>..From: Sandy King [mailto:sanking@clemson.edu]
..>..Sent: Saturday, January 12, 2002 11:36 AM
..>..To: alt-photo-process-l@skyway.usask.ca
..>..Subject: RE: Albumen - How Archival
..>..
..>..
..>..Yes, we still have them but they have all either already yellowed, or
..>..will yellow with more time. As far as I have been able to determine
..>..there is nothing to stop or reverse the yellowing process.
..>..
..>..Sandy King
..>..
..>..
..>..
..>..>We still have them from the mid 1800's. Gold toning is
..>..recommended. I think
..>..>the paper type is the biggest concern once toned.
..>..>
..>..>..-----Original Message-----
..>..>..From: George Huczek [mailto:ghuczek@sk.sympatico.ca]
..>..>..Sent: Saturday, January 12, 2002 10:44 AM
..>..>..To: alt-photo-process-l@skyway.usask.ca
..>..>..Subject: Albumen - How Archival
..>..>..
..>..>..
..>..>..If done properly, how archival can one expect albumen prints
..>..to be? Does
..>..>..anyone have any suggestions for how increased permanence can
..>..be obtained
..>..>..with this process?
..>..>..
..>..>..
..>..
..>..
..>..--
..>..
..
..
..--
..
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