Re: Direct Carbon PHOTOGRAPHY Wise

Dear Art, Thank you so much for all of the following which more than answers
my interest in your Fresson involvement. It also explains your own concerns
with the Direct Carbon process and how you think it may be related to Fresson
technology. I also remember, clearly, when you enquired via the Shutterbugs
publication how you could obtain Fresson prints as your local photo store was
not offering a service for this. What year was that? 1992 or thereabouts?
You seem to have come a long way since then, that`s for sure. I really do wish
you more strength to your project and hope that, in the not too distant future,
we shall be able to purchase Direct Carbon paper, similar to that which was
made by the Fressons (and Luis Nadeau) but is no longer available.
                  When I was offering samples of my own Direct Carbon
printing to members of this list, several years back long before digital imaging
invaded the scene, I had only twenty replies from a list of about five hundred
people. After sending these free samples out very few of them even acknowledged
receipt of the prints and I decided then that there was no imediate future for
my research, at least, in the making of Direct carbon paper for the market.
Maybe the climate of interest has improved over the last six years, or so. My
resources have diminished but I am still doing my own work which is my
greatest reward.
         Thanks again. Please contact me off list if there is anything you
would NOT wish to be made public, at this stage.
                        Sincerely. John Grocott - Photographist.
                  
> I will attempt to answer your questions but please feel free to contact me
> off-line if I missed the mark.
>
> My opinion of digital bromoil would be the same as digital Fresson . . .
> what's your point? If you want an inkjet or rather a pigment print, that's
> great as they can be very attractive as a straight photograph as well as an
> interpreted graphic when modified by the various effects possible in
> Photoshop. If you like the looks of an inkjet print processed with the
soon
> to be released Rembrandt 'Night Watch' Photoshop filter well have at it,
but
> you might take a trip Amsterdam to catch a glimpse of the original painting
> before day dreaming about future revenue.
>
> Speaking of disclosing information, I have presented/shared my work at
three
> different APIS meeting over the past 8 years. My printing process is made
> possible through the unique characteristics of a colloidal mixture of gum
> arabic and gelatin. Reference US patent 5,215,837 for specific
formula(and
> a
> surefire cure for insomnia), example one can provide good results but keep
> in
> mind that I will defend my patent rights for any commercial application.
> Furthermore, in a period of time when I was unable to test/print I
satisfied
> my photographic appetite through having analytical testing done on samples
> of
> original Fresson printing papers (as furnished by Bill Foster who had
saved
> it from when he was an active Fresson printer) as well as Fresson
monochrome
> and color prints. Though my patent had already been issued, I was keenly
> interested in determining if I had truly discovered the Fresson secret
> process. The testing performed includes Optical Microscopy, Electron
> Microscopy (Cambridge S360 Scanning Electron Microscope SEM), Elemental
> Microanalysis (Link eXL Energy Dispersive X-Ray Spectrometer EDX), Infrared
> Spectroscopy (Mattson 5020 Fourier Transform Infrared Spectrometer FTIR),
> and
> Protein Identification (Amino Acid Profile by Acid Hydrolysis - classical
> ninhyroid post column). Those tests confirm that the Fresson chemistry
> utilizes the same gum arabic and gelatin mixture as I had discovered.
Hang
> onto your hat as this still doesn't give the store away . . . the process
is
> VERY physical in nature and the exact Fresson coating process and method
is
> an
> ongoing Fresson secret. In short, if you want a Fresson print there is
> only
> one place to go and that’s to the Fresson workshop located on the
outskirts
> of
> Paris.
>
> As to the development process for Fresson, this was widely known as anyone
> who
> purchased Fresson paper in the pre-WWII era would have used it. It is not
a
> secret that Echague published as it seems to come across in your note. The
> directions to develop Fresson paper (converted to Fahrenheit) are as
follows:
>
> 1. Cool Soak - 30 to 60 seconds in a tray of water at about 70°F to
wet
> the paper
> 2. Warm soak varies as follows:
> Flat/low contrast negative = 87.8°F for .33 minutes
> Normal contrast negative = 84.2°F for .75 minutes
> High contrast negative = 80.6°F for 1.5 to 2 minutes
> 3. Abrasion develop by pouring an ambient water sawdust slurry over
the
> face of the print. Local control is possible by directing the
> mixture
> to further develop or under-develop areas as desired.
> My own ‘standard’ development is a 1 minute cool soak and then a 1 minute
> warm
> soak at 84°F followed by the sawdust slurry treatment. Total development
> time
> for a 9x12 print is typically less than five minutes. One noteworthy item
> is
> that unlike many photographic processes this one is free of odor and
> furthermore is just plain fun . . . sort of a throw back to childhood
> sandbox
> activities. Lastly, the development room of the Fresson workshop is set
up
> to
> perform the described procedure.
>
> I hope this answered your questions.
>
> Sincerely, Art
>
>
> P.S. As to the "Business Wise" of direct carbon . . . I believe we may have
> opposing views as to the location of this dog’s body and tail. Alternative
> printing is a minuscule portion of the photographic marketplace and the
pot
> at
> the end of the rainbow might be different from what you imagine. Try this
on
> for size . . . alternative photographic printing processes should be
> preserved
> for their beauty!
>
>
>
> On Tue, 02 Aug 2005 04:38:32 -0400 (EDT), Grafist wrote
> > In a message dated 31/07/05 16:52:45 GMT Daylight Time,
> > achakali@wideopenwest.com writes:
> >
> > > John,
> > >
> > > I will attempt to answer your questions. Please feel free to contact
> me
> > > off-line if I missed the mark.
> > ................................................
> > Art, Thank you so much for spending the time to discuss some of the
> > Direct Carbon and Fresson issues. Over the past ten years, or so,
> > there have been many postings on this list regarding the historical,
> > technical and aesthetic aspects. I think it must be one of the most
> > long standing subjects together with GUM, of course. Judy's Post
> > Factory No 9 issue on Fresson has an historic value which would be
> > difficult to surpass in its comprehensiveness. But there surely must
> > be more ongoing work being done by students of photographic printing
> > which will widen the picture even more over the coming years whether
> > or not there is a digital link. I recently heard about something
> > called ''digital bromoil'' and thought it must be a joke. It was
> > bromoil technique simulated by software. Digital Fresson? Why not?
> > I will contact you ''off list'' if the subject
> > becomes private or involved with personal financial business matters,
> > but as regards dialogue concerning processing I am sure many
> > readers would be interested to learn more about the social
> > connections we have made during our search for information and the
> > leads which have helped us in our research. Bill
> > Foster knew and had met Echague way back but inspite of their close
> > relationship apparently never acquired any cutting edge infomation
> > from him on processing. Echague was extremely wealthy and successful
> > with many publications of his images of Spanish life origionally
> > made using the Fresson process. However, Echague
> > did publish an outline of his working methods using Fresson paper
> > and sawdust to develop and this has been very useful to me in my
> > experimenting with Direct Carbon techniques. I can provide a brief
> > resume if anyone would be interested through a future posting
> > depending on the reaction of list members to this offer.
> > Business wise the way ahead is not clear. As you say, much
> > money and effort is needed to make the whole thing work viably and
> > commercially. Personally, I am not in a position to give away free
> > the results of thousands of hours of painstaking testing only to
> > hear further down the road that someone is marketing a product
> > based on my research. This is why I do not wish to patent my
> > findings which would make the critical information available to
> > public investigation. What I discovered in
> > the formulation of the process was totally new in concept to
> > anything which I had read in publications of formulae. In fact, as
> > with Artigue, it was an accident while experimenting with known
> > recipes which gave the clue to further work which gave me the final
method.
>
> > Again, Judy's article in PF No. 9 contains
> > most of what I am refering to. I would suggest to anyone who
> > seriously wants to devote several hundred hours to Direct Carbon
> > research, to obtain a copy. Thanks again, Judy !
> > The quest goes on.
> > Cheers John- photographist
>
Received on Wed Aug 10 08:22:19 2005