U of S | Mailing List Archive | alt-photo-process-l | Re: venetian blinds, Epson 1280

Re: venetian blinds, Epson 1280

Title: Re: venetian blinds, Epson 1280

Laying down more ink on Pictorico may be an option for many people, but it is not for me. My primary printing process is carbon, and I make a very thick tissue (to get maximum relief) that requires very long exposures. For example, an exposure for palladium that would require about 90-120 units/seconds on my AmergGraph ULF-28 requires about 500 units/seconds with carbon. That length exposure creates too much heat, so I expose carbon only with the BL bank, which is about a stop slower, leaving me with an exposure time of about 1000 units/seconds with the Ultrafine substrate. In principle the difference in UV blocking is only about 1/3 stop between regular Pictorico and Ultrafine, but in practice, because of self-masking, the difference is much greater, more than a stop in fact. So an exposure with the Ultrafine substrate that takes 1000 units/seconds will take more than 2000 units/seconds with Pictorico.

And the problem of course is that you can not lay down more ink on the Ultrafine material because drying is very slow and you would get pizza wheel marks.


At 6:36 PM -0500 3/3/07, Ender100@aol.com wrote:

That's a pretty good general description of current printers.  Except for the R1400, I have tested them all and am currently testing the 3800.

Venetian Blinds
The R1800 definitely has not yet shown a problem with Venetian Blinds.  The R2400 shows the least Venetian Blinds of all the other printers.  I have not yet tested the 3800 for Venetian Blinds, but will do so this week.

you should have no problem with microbanding with any of the latest printers.  The head allignment is very good on these printers and by doing a head allignment this problem is eliminated.

Ink density
Here I'll differ with Sandy on this point.
With the R2400 and the 3800, the inks are indeed less dense than the older 2200 inks, but you have an option with these printers using ink configuration to increase the amount of ink laid down.  I have no doubt that you can get enough density for any process using this feature.  Unfortunately the R1800 does not have this feature.  If you also use the new Pictorico Ultra OHP film, which will take an incredble load, you can get even more dense negatives using ink configuration.  Note:  this feature on the 3800 is actually located under "Paper Configuration".

While the 3800 definitely costs more than the R2400, if you figure in the additional amount of ink you get with the 80  ml cartridges, this reduces the cost differential dramatically.

With the R2400 and the 3800, the Advanced Black & WHite printing mode makes incredible black and white inkjet prints.

The 3800 is probably the smoothest printer I have tested so far.

Best Wishes,
Mark Nelson

Precision Digital Negatives - The System
PDNPrint Forum at Yahoo Groups

In a message dated 3/3/07 5:05:42 PM, sanking@clemson.edu writes:


I am hesitant to recommend any printer because none of the ones I know do everything I want.

If you want the large negative the 3800 is very smooth,  but one is limited to a maximum  negative DR of about 2.05, ok for most alternative processes but  not quite high enough for albumen, salted paper, VDB, etc.

The R1800 also prints very smooth, but has the same limitation in terms of DR as the 3800. Also, the pigmented inks don't dry fast which makes it problematic for me since I u se the Ultrafine OHP instead of Pictorico.

The 1400 is also very smooth, but has low UV blocking with the colors, so the only way to get adequate density for alt printing is to desaturate the RGB file and print in color, which gives a neutral black tone negative with a maximum DR of about 1.80. This worked out perfect for me since with the Epson 2200 I had settled on a combination of Green and Blue that also gave a DR of 1.8, and this is also the DR to which I develop my in-camera negatives.  And the dye inks of the 1400 dry very fast so pizza wheel marks is not a problem. And the 1400 is a good candidate for making digital negatives for silver printing because the tones are so smooth.

The pigment ink set of the 2400 gives  more UV  blocking density than any of the other current Epson printers, but it too is subject to the Venetian blind disease.  In fact, according to Mark Nelson, the only printer that is not subject to Venetian blinds is the R1800. We can not say yet about the 3800 and 1400  because this disease usually strikes when the printer has some age on it.

In any event, the Venetian blind problem is my biggest concern. I have a perfectly wonderful Epson 2200 that does everything I want from it and can print negatives of the right DR for any alternative process, but it has a very mile case of Venetian  blind disease that shows up with scenes where there is a lot of broad areas of upper mid-tones and highlights.

You can try running the head alignment, as others have suggested,  but this may not cure the problem if the printer has some age on it. But by all means give  it a try.

Sandy King
At 10:24 PM -0500 3/2/07, SusanV wrote:

Sandy... I know you've been testing several printers lately, and I've
been reading your comments with interest.  I'm new though, to digital
negatives, so some of it is flying over my head.... some of it is
beginning to sink in.  I'm making positives on pictorico ohp, for
making polymer gravures... I'd be interested in knowing which printer
you'd recommend at this point.  I would need 13" wide capability.
Thanks for all the testing and reporting you do on this stuff.


gravure blog at www.susanvossgravures.blogspot.com
website www.dalyvoss.com

On 3/2/07, Sandy King <sanking@clemson.edu> wrote:
Based on my experience with this problem on several Epson printers,
IMHO the only real and true fix is EBAY.


At 9:44 PM -0500 3/2/07, SusanV wrote:
>Can anyone please tell me what to do about my Epson 1280 printing with
>those little horozontal lines... I assume that's what I see referred
>to as venetian blinds?  Is there any fix?  I'm trying to get some good
>positives on OHP for photogravure, then these darned lines start
>showing up.
>gravure blog at www.susanvossgravures.blogspot.com
>website www.dalyvoss.com

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