U of S | Mailing List Archive | alt-photo-process-l | RE: HP B9180 for digital negatives

RE: HP B9180 for digital negatives


OK, thanks for the clarification. I was clearly confused by what you wrote.

I have made some very nice prints in carbon, kallitype and pt./pd. from digital negatives off the Epson 2200. However, I am not quite satisfied that the results in carbon are as good as I get from contact printing high quality in-camera negatives. Very close, but maybe not quite there. Well, yes, as good in larger sizes where some magnification of the negative is involved, but not quite there with same size contact prints from original in-camera negatives.

With pt./pd. I think the results are just as good as from in-camera negatives, with a few caveats. But the goal is to be able to make digital negatives on an inkjet printer that will print in carbon, silver and pt/pd as smooth as LF or ULF negatives. When I find a printer that will do that, and that I can afford, I will stay with the same horse.

I don't take Wilhem's word as that of God either, but on the whole I find him to be the most credible source on image stability out there.

Sandy King

At 2:45 PM -0500 3/15/07, EJN Photo wrote:
Sandy, I guess I didn't make myself very clear there. I meant that with the
yearly transition that is happening in inks, printers, and substrates that
it is best to stay with the horse you're on, instead of always looking for a
smoother faster ride, unless of course the ride is getting way too rough or
you need to pull a much bigger wagon.

I also was saying that quoting Wilhelm may not be the best place to start a
conversation about image permanence. I say this only because there are just
so many variables that influence print permanence that he doesn't cover some
that are quite important. He should certainly be included in the discussion
but that his findings are NOT written in or by the hand of the Photo Gods.

Eric Neilsen Photography
4101 Commerce Street, Suite 9
Dallas, TX 75226

Skype : ejprinter
 -----Original Message-----
 From: Sandy King [mailto:sanking@clemson.edu]
 Sent: Tuesday, March 13, 2007 12:42 PM
 To: alt-photo-process-l@usask.ca
 Subject: RE: HP B9180 for digital negatives

 Time will tell about the permanence of the HP pigment printers.
 However, I don't believe there is any doubt at all but that
 prints made from the last two generations of Epson printers
 have the
 potential, depending on final support,  for much better
 than prints made by any other color printing process,
 historical or
 contemporary, save three-color carbon and carbro type
 processes. I
 have enough color prints from the 2200 hanging around in very
 spots to know that they are very resistant to fading, and you
 boil them in water and the color does not change. I would
 expect at
 least as much stability from the monochrome prints made with
 pigmented ink sets. My personal opinion is that they will prove
 the long run more stable than any type of silver print,
 assuming they
 are printed on the right kind of paper.

 As for digital negatives, they appear highly resistant to UV. I
 not seen any change in the UV printing density of digital
 with multiple printings.

 Sandy King

 At 12:02 PM -0500 3/13/07, EJN Photo wrote:
 >Before anyone gets to excited by HP, Canon or new Espon Ink,
 I'd just like
 >to say that as fast as thing change that last thing you need
 to do is keep
 >reinventing the wheel. I haven't looked at Wilhelm's site
 lately, but just
 >because he post that something will last doesn't make it so.
 >I suppose that since you are talking digital negs you are not
 really after a
 >lasting image, but many will also use those very same ink sets
 to make
 >prints. Have fun : )
 >Eric Neilsen Photography
 >4101 Commerce Street, Suite 9
 >Dallas, TX 75226
 >Skype : ejprinter
 > >>  -----Original Message-----
 >>  From: Sandy King [mailto:sanking@clemson.edu]
 >>  Sent: Tuesday, March 13, 2007 11:51 AM
 >>  To: alt-photo-process-l@usask.ca
 >>  Subject: Re: HP B9180 for digital negatives
 >>  Michael,
 >>  I believe the nearest sister/brother in the Epson line to
 >>  HP
 >>  B9180 is the R2400. In fact, Ted Harris has called the
 B9180 an
 >>  "Epson 2400 killer" because of the performance and price.
 >>  Will scan the arrays printed by the B9180 and send them
 when I
 >>  get a chance.
 >>  Sandy
 >>  At 11:27 AM -0600 3/13/07, Michael Koch-Schulte wrote:
 >>  >Wow! Maybe this does end Epson's hegemony of the printer
 >>  market. Nahhh! What
 >>  >Epson printer does one compare this to? The 1400, 1800 or
 >>  2400? Does anyone
 >>  >on the list have the little sister/brother to this printer
 >>  Deskjet 9800,
 >>  >also a 13" printer (<$300)?. I think the 9180 has the
 >>  ink set and
 >>  >the 9800 uses dye-based inks. Sandy, if you would be so
 >>  as to send me a
 >>  >scan of the arrays when you've got a moment. Thanks.
 >>  >~m
 >>  >p.s. for anyone interested in my RNP-Arrays they're posted
 >>  >hybridphoto.com under the Digital Negatives forum.
 >>  >
 >>  >----- Original Message -----
 >>  >From: "Sandy King" <sanking@clemson.edu>
 >>  >To: <alt-photo-process-l@usask.ca>
 >>  >Sent: Tuesday, March 13, 2007 9:27 AM
 >>  >Subject: HP B9180 for digital negatives
 >>  >
 >>  >
 >>  >>  In conjunction with another person I just ran some
 >>  for UV
 >>  >>  blocking density with the HP B9180 printer, which is a
 >>  wide
 >>  >>  pigment printer of similar characteristics and
 >>  to the
 >>  >>  Epsons 1800/2400.
 >>  >>
 >>  >>  The results are very encouraging. The UV blocking of
 >>  by itself
 >>  >>  in the PDN tonal palette is log 4.75, Red is log 2.58
 >>  Blue is log
 >>  >>  1.31. The practical consequence is that there is a wide
 >>  range of
 >>  >>  specific color matches on the PDN color palette that
 >>  work for
 >>  >>  any given alternative process. I also checked Michael
 >>  Schultze's
 >>  >>  color arrays and you can find multiple working squares
 >>  there as well.
 >>  >>
 >>  >>  I will continue my tests today of this printer for
 >>  smoothness and
 >>  >tonality.
 >>  >>
 >>  >>  Sandy King