[alt-photo] Re: Nature of Curtis Orotones WAS Re: wet-plate collodion

[Barry Singer]

This is very interesting.

By the way years ago I tried something based on what I thought was the 
Orotone process.  I printed a positive image on transparency film and 
then spray painted the back of the film with gold spray paint.  Didn't 
look too bad.

Barry Singer

Jeremy Moore wrote:
> I'm now very curious about Curtis's historical (non-contemporary)
> Orotones and what his process was as I have never heard of them being
> Ambrotypes (positive wet plate collodion on glass).
>
> Based on the page Joe linked us to:
>
> "Edward S. Curtis [1]   (1868-1952) used the orotone principally for a
> series of portraits of North American indians. He describes [2] his
> orotones more under an aesthetic than a technical angle.The general
> bibliography mentions that the gold tone was obtained by putting gold
> leaves on the back of the silver-gelatin glass plate, by backing with
> gold paint or with a medium of gold dust and banana oil. A commercial
> brochure from 1903 [3] describes that the backing consisted of a
> combination of banana oil and bronze powders."
>
> The only place I see the discussion of collodion is here:
>
> "In a recent study (2005) at the Art Department of the University of
> Delaware [4], Richard Stenman researched a series of orotone
> photographs by different photographers of the beginning of the 20th
> century. The technical analysis was made by using ultraviolet
> fluorescence, x-ray fluorescence (XRF), Fourier-transform infrared
> spectroscopy (FTIR), et scanning electron microscopy coupled with
> energy dispersive x-ray spectroscopy (SEM-EDS).
>
> THE EMULSION LAYER CONSISTED OF GELATIN AND/OR COLLODION [emphasis
> mine]. In each of the examined gold tone layers, bronze powder
> containing copper and zinc was used. This corroborates the decription
> of the Curtis Studio brochure."
>
> The problem is this is the only place they say the layer consisted of
> "gelatin and/or collodion" and when I checked the footnote ([4]--I've
> included all footnotes below) I have not been able to find the
> referenced newsletter as the link is both malformed and dead. Can
> anyone here point me in the correct direction to get the 2006
> newsletter referenced in footnote 4? Does anyone know Richard Stenman?
>
> [1] www.soulcatcherstudio.com/.../curtis_cron.html
> Edward S. Curtis and The North American Indian
> A detailed chronological biography
>
> [2] http://www.edwardcurtis.com/
> Curtis wrote: "The ordinary photographic print, however good, lacks
> depth and translucency. We all know how beautiful are the stones and
> pebbles in the limpid brook of the forest, yet when we take the same
> iridescent pebbles from the water and dry them they are dull and
> lifeless; so it is with the orthodox photographic print, but in the
> Goldtones all the translucency is retained and they are as full of
> life and sparkle as an opal."
>
>  [3] Advertising brochure for the Curtis Studio, 1903.
> Edward S. Curtis perfected the medium regarded as Goldtone or Orotone
> to the extent he eventually named these images after himself calling
> them "Curt-Tones". Most photographic prints are a positive image on
> paper. The Curt-Tone process Curtis used was created by taking a clear
> plate of optical glass and spread a liquid emulsion onto the surface
> of the plate. Curtis then projected his negative onto the glass to
> create a positive image. The highlights and shadows could not be seen
> unless there was some type of backing on the image. He mixed a
> combination of banana oils and bronzing powders to create a sepia or a
> goldtone effect, and then spread this mixture onto the dried emulsion.
>
> [4] Icom cc.icom.museum/ Documents/ Working Group/ Photographic/
> Newsletter - 01-2006.pdf
>
> On Wed, Apr 14, 2010 at 8:43 AM, Joseph Smigiel <smieglitz at gmail.com> wrote:
>   
>> Jeffrey,
>>
>> See:
>> http://www.permadocument.be/texte/YRK/RFK/OPIUM%20FIELDS/RKE3.html
>>
>> Mention is made there of "bronze powders" as well as collodion and the gold leaf/banana oil method on dry plate positives.  I've also read elsewhere about the process but do not recall the source.
>>
>> I think the gold leaf would be prohibitively expensive.
>>
>> Dan Burkholder is using gold leaf and vellum with his Pt/Pd printing process.   Perhaps he can comment with further historical info.
>>
>> Joe
>>
>>
>> On Apr 14, 2010, at 9:16 AM, Jeremy Moore wrote:
>>
>>     
>>> Joe,
>>>
>>> What's the reasoning behind this? I haven't heard this suggestion
>>> before--that they are wet plate collodion positives backed with brass powder
>>> as opposed to silver gelatin dry plate backed with gold leaf in a banana oil
>>> suspension.
>>>
>>> On Tue, Apr 13, 2010 at 10:31 PM, Joseph Smigiel <smieglitz at gmail.com>wrote:
>>>
>>>       
>>>> I believe Curtis' Orotones were actually ambrotypes backed with a brass
>>>> powder.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Apr 13, 2010, at 9:39 PM, Bob Barnes wrote:
>>>>
>>>>  PS; what were Sherriff Edward Curtis'  (sorry for the oblique humous)
>>>>         
>>>>> gold-tone prints?
>>>>>  PSS; your arcticle on Unblinking Eye really encouraged me, but the
>>>>> toxicity is still intimidating.
>>>>> Bob
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>           
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