[alt-photo] Re: Nature of Curtis Orotones WAS Re: wet-platecollodion

Mon Apr 19 20:28:48 GMT 2010

Last year in a small gallery in Hollywood, I saw an exhibit of orotones by 
Matthew Betcher. Quite extraordinary and interesting...see the link here:

http://c4gallery.com/artist/matthew-betcher/matthew-betcher-orotones.html

p

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Barry Singer" <bsinger at sasktel.net>
To: "The alternative photographic processes mailing list" 
<alt-photo-process-list at lists.altphotolist.org>
Sent: Monday, April 19, 2010 12:52 PM
Subject: [alt-photo] Re: Nature of Curtis Orotones WAS Re: 
wet-platecollodion

> This is very interesting.
>
> By the way years ago I tried something based on what I thought was the 
> Orotone process.  I printed a positive image on transparency film and then 
> spray painted the back of the film with gold spray paint.  Didn't look too 
> bad.
>
> Barry Singer
>
> Jeremy Moore wrote:
>> I'm now very curious about Curtis's historical (non-contemporary)
>> Orotones and what his process was as I have never heard of them being
>> Ambrotypes (positive wet plate collodion on glass).
>>
>> Based on the page Joe linked us to:
>>
>> "Edward S. Curtis [1]   (1868-1952) used the orotone principally for a
>> series of portraits of North American indians. He describes [2] his
>> orotones more under an aesthetic than a technical angle.The general
>> bibliography mentions that the gold tone was obtained by putting gold
>> leaves on the back of the silver-gelatin glass plate, by backing with
>> gold paint or with a medium of gold dust and banana oil. A commercial
>> brochure from 1903 [3] describes that the backing consisted of a
>> combination of banana oil and bronze powders."
>>
>> The only place I see the discussion of collodion is here:
>>
>> "In a recent study (2005) at the Art Department of the University of
>> Delaware [4], Richard Stenman researched a series of orotone
>> photographs by different photographers of the beginning of the 20th
>> century. The technical analysis was made by using ultraviolet
>> fluorescence, x-ray fluorescence (XRF), Fourier-transform infrared
>> spectroscopy (FTIR), et scanning electron microscopy coupled with
>> energy dispersive x-ray spectroscopy (SEM-EDS).
>>
>> THE EMULSION LAYER CONSISTED OF GELATIN AND/OR COLLODION [emphasis
>> mine]. In each of the examined gold tone layers, bronze powder
>> containing copper and zinc was used. This corroborates the decription
>> of the Curtis Studio brochure."
>>
>> The problem is this is the only place they say the layer consisted of
>> "gelatin and/or collodion" and when I checked the footnote ([4]--I've
>> included all footnotes below) I have not been able to find the
>> referenced newsletter as the link is both malformed and dead. Can
>> anyone here point me in the correct direction to get the 2006
>> newsletter referenced in footnote 4? Does anyone know Richard Stenman?
>>
>> [1] www.soulcatcherstudio.com/.../curtis_cron.html
>> Edward S. Curtis and The North American Indian
>> A detailed chronological biography
>>
>> [2] http://www.edwardcurtis.com/
>> Curtis wrote: "The ordinary photographic print, however good, lacks
>> depth and translucency. We all know how beautiful are the stones and
>> pebbles in the limpid brook of the forest, yet when we take the same
>> iridescent pebbles from the water and dry them they are dull and
>> lifeless; so it is with the orthodox photographic print, but in the
>> Goldtones all the translucency is retained and they are as full of
>> life and sparkle as an opal."
>>
>>  [3] Advertising brochure for the Curtis Studio, 1903.
>> Edward S. Curtis perfected the medium regarded as Goldtone or Orotone
>> to the extent he eventually named these images after himself calling
>> them "Curt-Tones". Most photographic prints are a positive image on
>> paper. The Curt-Tone process Curtis used was created by taking a clear
>> plate of optical glass and spread a liquid emulsion onto the surface
>> of the plate. Curtis then projected his negative onto the glass to
>> create a positive image. The highlights and shadows could not be seen
>> unless there was some type of backing on the image. He mixed a
>> combination of banana oils and bronzing powders to create a sepia or a
>> goldtone effect, and then spread this mixture onto the dried emulsion.
>>
>> [4] Icom cc.icom.museum/ Documents/ Working Group/ Photographic/
>> Newsletter - 01-2006.pdf
>>
>> On Wed, Apr 14, 2010 at 8:43 AM, Joseph Smigiel <smieglitz at gmail.com> 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Jeffrey,
>>>
>>> See:
>>> http://www.permadocument.be/texte/YRK/RFK/OPIUM%20FIELDS/RKE3.html
>>>
>>> Mention is made there of "bronze powders" as well as collodion and the 
>>> gold leaf/banana oil method on dry plate positives.  I've also read 
>>> elsewhere about the process but do not recall the source.
>>>
>>> I think the gold leaf would be prohibitively expensive.
>>>
>>> Dan Burkholder is using gold leaf and vellum with his Pt/Pd printing 
>>> process.   Perhaps he can comment with further historical info.
>>>
>>> Joe
>>>
>>>
>>> On Apr 14, 2010, at 9:16 AM, Jeremy Moore wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>> Joe,
>>>>
>>>> What's the reasoning behind this? I haven't heard this suggestion
>>>> before--that they are wet plate collodion positives backed with brass 
>>>> powder
>>>> as opposed to silver gelatin dry plate backed with gold leaf in a 
>>>> banana oil
>>>> suspension.
>>>>
>>>> On Tue, Apr 13, 2010 at 10:31 PM, Joseph Smigiel 
>>>> <smieglitz at gmail.com>wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> I believe Curtis' Orotones were actually ambrotypes backed with a 
>>>>> brass
>>>>> powder.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Apr 13, 2010, at 9:39 PM, Bob Barnes wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>  PS; what were Sherriff Edward Curtis'  (sorry for the oblique humous)
>>>>>
>>>>>> gold-tone prints?
>>>>>>  PSS; your arcticle on Unblinking Eye really encouraged me, but the
>>>>>> toxicity is still intimidating.
>>>>>> Bob
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Alt-photo-process-list | http://altphotolist.org/listinfo
>>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Alt-photo-process-list | http://altphotolist.org/listinfo
>>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Alt-photo-process-list | http://altphotolist.org/listinfo
>>
>>
> _______________________________________________
> Alt-photo-process-list | http://altphotolist.org/listinfo 