[alt-photo] Re: ECONOMICS OF TONING

Mon Sep 5 20:30:07 GMT 2011

Hi Bob,

Before starting, you'd better note that I have no experience in pt or
pd toning (with right salt I mean!) any kind of iron-silver print, but
I still could swear by gold toning, see below:

- I can get great color variation purple brown, cool brown, dead
neutral gray, coolish gray with gold. (Depends on toner strength /
time and paper's base color...)
- I can get great dmax with gold; as much as or slightly better (to my
eyes) than a well done straight pop pd print.
- Despite gold salts being pricey, actual toning cost isn't that much
high; IIRC, you use exactly the same amnt. of pt / pd or gold salt per
same volume of toner solution (was it 1g per 1000ml?), but the gold
toner (gold-thiourea) works equally well at half, even one-third
strength IME. (Toning time increase yes, but not unbearable. And in
that case - I mean diluted, you'll be spending less $, compared to
full strength pt or pd toners...)

Regards,
Loris.

2011/9/5 BOB KISS <bobkiss at caribsurf.com>:
> DEAR FRANCIS & LORIS,
>        Don't worry, I only do DOP PT/PD printing so I have the right kind
> of palladium chloride.
> *****Still hoping there might be some alternative formulae...just for
> variation's sake.
>                CHEERS!
>                        BOB
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: alt-photo-process-list-bounces at lists.altphotolist.org
> [mailto:alt-photo-process-list-bounces at lists.altphotolist.org] On Behalf Of
> francis schanberger
> Sent: Monday, September 05, 2011 2:32 PM
> To: The alternative photographic processes mailing list
> Subject: [alt-photo] Re: ECONOMICS OF TONING
>
> not really staining. LiPd seamed to warm up the paper ground in unexposed or
> uncoated areas. yes, my dmax (exposed ground) also got anemic looking.
>
> -francis
>
> On Mon, Sep 5, 2011 at 12:05 PM, Loris Medici <mail at loris.medici.name>wrote:
>
>> Equally bad results here too; IME, LiPd toner definitely reduced both
>> the dmax and the contrast or the print (and the resulting color was
>> awful too!), I don't remember any staining though - could be my
>> memory...
>>
>>
>> 2011/9/5 francis schanberger <frangst at gmail.com>:
>> > Be careful which palladium salt you use. I tried to use up some LiPd
> from
>> > Ziatype to tone vandyke browns and it seemed to reduce the contrast of
>> the
>> > print by staining the highlights.
>> >
>> > -francis
>> >
>> > On Mon, Sep 5, 2011 at 9:44 AM, BOB KISS <bobkiss at caribsurf.com> wrote:
>> >
>> >> DEAR RYUJI,
>> >>        Perhaps you can help with my original question relating to the
>> fact
>> >> that palladium is now less expensive than gold.  Why not tone albumen,
>> >> salt,
>> >> and POP prints with palladium instead of gold?  And I would love as
> many
>> >> palladium toner formulae as I can get.  I only found one in Christopher
>> >> James' book.  Know of any others?
>> >>                CHEERS!
>> >>                        BOB
>> >>
>> >> -----Original Message-----
>> >> From: alt-photo-process-list-bounces at lists.altphotolist.org
>> >> [mailto:alt-photo-process-list-bounces at lists.altphotolist.org] On
>> Behalf
>> >> Of
>> >> Ryuji Suzuki
>> >> Sent: Monday, September 05, 2011 12:50 AM
>> >> To: alt-photo-process-list at lists.altphotolist.org
>> >> Subject: [alt-photo] Re: ECONOMICS OF TONING
>> >>
>> >> From: Keith Gerling <keith.gerling at gmail.com>
>> >> Subject: [alt-photo] Re: ECONOMICS OF TONING
>> >> Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2011 13:01:26 -0500
>> >>
>> >> > I have no expertise in toning, but I do find it ironic that
>> >> > so many people want to sepia, or brown-town a silver-gelatin
>> >> > print, but when confronted with a brown or sepia VanDyke,
>> >> > argyrotype, etc., the first inclination is to blacken it
>> >> > with gold-toning.
>> >>
>> >> There are a few different types of sulfiding toners, but the
>> >> range of results varies widely depending on how you use
>> >> them. If you use brown toner (a solution of liver of sulfur)
>> >> very lightly, you don't see much visual effects immediately
>> >> but you'll realize increase in density when the print is
>> >> completely dried (and the image is still black). You see
>> >> similar density increase with selenium but in that case you
>> >> already see the effects while the print is in the toning
>> >> bath. This is with silver gelatin process where the image
>> >> forming silver particles are bigger than the materials you
>> >> mentioned. With print out silver images, the image silver is
>> >> so tiny that most sulfiding toning bath would probably react
>> >> too fast. But I wonder if there's a good way to slow down and
>> >> limit the rate of toning reaction so as to achieve the density
>> >> increase without significantly browning or yellowing the image.
>> >>
>> >> If you are only concerned about protecting silver image
>> >> without changing the image tone or density, I came up with an
>> >> easy and inexpensive method...
>> >>
>> >> --
>> >> Ryuji Suzuki
>> >> "If I want to find out anything, I'm not gonna read Time magazine, I'm
>> >> not gonna read Newsweek, I'm not gonna read any of these
>> >> magazines. Because they have got too much to lose by printing the
>> >> truth." (Bob Dylan, Don't Look Back, 1965)
>> >> _______________________________________________
>> >> Alt-photo-process-list | http://altphotolist.org/listinfo
>> >>
>> >> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus
>> >> signature
>> >> database 6437 (20110905) __________
>> >>
>> >> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.
>> >>
>> >> http://www.eset.com
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> _______________________________________________
>> >> Alt-photo-process-list | http://altphotolist.org/listinfo
>> >>
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > --
>> > francis schanberger
>> >
>> > www.francisschanberger.com
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > Alt-photo-process-list | http://altphotolist.org/listinfo
>> >
>> _______________________________________________
>> Alt-photo-process-list | http://altphotolist.org/listinfo
>>
>
>
>
> --
> francis schanberger
>
> www.francisschanberger.com
> _______________________________________________
> Alt-photo-process-list | http://altphotolist.org/listinfo
>
> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature
> database 6439 (20110905) __________
>
> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.
>
> http://www.eset.com
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Alt-photo-process-list | http://altphotolist.org/listinfo
>