[alt-photo] Re: Preshrinking paper for gum?

Thu Jan 17 23:31:58 GMT 2013

So I guess I read wrong at first.  I meant to ask for examples of the press type you use, so "soft" press, not cold press

On Jan 17, 2013, at 5:12 PM, Diana Bloomfield <dhbloomfield at bellsouth.net> wrote:

> Their cold press is very textured.  I've never tried it.  I like smooth papers for platinum printing, but for gum-- I don't know-- I like a little texture.  So are you doing gum on COT 320, then?  
> 
> Diana
> On Jan 17, 2013, at 5:29 PM, Kurt Nagy wrote:
> 
>> Do you have an examples of their cold press?  I like smooth hot press papers, I'm currently using COT 320 and have no issues but I'd like to see what Fabriano looks like.
>> 
>> I don't size with COT 320 and get great results (I think)
>> 
>> On Jan 17, 2013, at 4:19 PM, Diana Bloomfield <dhbloomfield at bellsouth.net> wrote:
>> 
>>> Do you mean other papers by Fabriano, or other paper brands?  
>>> 
>>> I have tried that on other Fabriano papers, specifically their hot-press and cold press papers. I never liked their hot-press, even when I would pre-shrink and size.  I didn't mind the 300 lb hot-press paper so much, except that it was a bit like chopping wood to make smaller pieces-- but I never liked the 140 lb hot press.  I'm not sure why. Something about the surface, and I also didn't like the way it seemed to get wrinkly after repeated water soaks.   Maybe I just like a bit more texture in my papers.  
>>> 
>>> But  . . . with the hot press, I found that the registration was too "off" for me, without first pre-shrinking.  This paper also has a lot of sizing in it, but once it soaks in water, so much of that is lost. For some reason, that's not the case with their soft-press.   If I did not pre-shrink-- the paper, of course, retained all its own sizing-- and so the first coat was great.  The subsequent coats were too mis-registered for me.  When I did size, I sized with a very thin coat of PVA, which I like a lot.  A thin coat just leaves a very slight sheen (not shiny), while still doing the job it's supposed to do.  Still-- using no sizing at all suited me a lot better.
>>> 
>>> I tried no sizing with Rives BFK, heavyweight-- but, again, lots of staining-- at least, too much for me.
>>> 
>>> I am also not familiar with other "soft-press" papers, labeled as such, though there may be some.  I simply followed Paul's excellent advice and so "discovered" the perfect paper.  And then I promptly stopped looking. 
>>> 
>>> Diana
>>> 
>>> On Jan 17, 2013, at 4:17 PM, Ricardo Wildberger Lisboa wrote:
>>> 
>>>> Diana,
>>>> Have you already tried that (not sizing) on other brand's soft-press papers? With what results?
>>>> Ricardo.
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Enviado via iPad
>>>> 
>>>> Em 17/01/2013, às 18:36, Diana Bloomfield <dhbloomfield at bellsouth.net> escreveu:
>>>> 
>>>>> Hi Ricardo,
>>>>> 
>>>>> No, I never size it, and I use that paper only for gum printing.  I've printed up to as many as 6 layers, with absolutely no issues.  In fact, I had more issues when I did size.  
>>>>> 
>>>>> I *think* it was Paul Viapiano on the List here who first suggested this paper-- maybe someone else, too-- I can't remember-- but I've been using it now for a long long time, and I've just never had an issue with it.  I've told people about it before, but I think they never hear the word "soft-press," so you have to ensure that you're getting Fabriano soft-press, because (in my experience), the other Fabriano papers (labeled hot press; rough; or cold press) do not work like that.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Diana
>>>>> 
>>>>> On Jan 17, 2013, at 3:17 PM, Ricardo Wildberger Lisboa wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>>> Diana and Denny, thank you for the information.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Diana, you say you don't even size on that paper? Don't you ever size the paper for gum printing?
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Ricardo.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Enviado via iPad
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Em 17/01/2013, às 16:30, Kurt Nagy <kakarott76 at hotmail.com> escreveu:
>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> I never preshrink either.  Only issues I have with registration come from my own lining up the negative
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> On Jan 17, 2013, at 12:18 PM, "Denny" <dspector at charter.net> wrote:
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> Diana, thanks, "almost seemed pointless" pretty much sums up what I found.
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>>> From: alt-photo-process-list-bounces at lists.altphotolist.org
>>>>>>>> [mailto:alt-photo-process-list-bounces at lists.altphotolist.org] On Behalf Of
>>>>>>>> Diana Bloomfield
>>>>>>>> Sent: Thursday, January 17, 2013 10:12 AM
>>>>>>>> To: The alternative photographic processes mailing list
>>>>>>>> Subject: [alt-photo] Re: Preshrinking paper for gum?
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> Hey Denny,
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> I don't shrink paper anymore--- with the paper I now use-- but back when I
>>>>>>>> did (and I never did real tests on it like you)-- I realized, at some point,
>>>>>>>> that the temperature of the water didn't really seem to matter much.   And
>>>>>>>> really hot water seemed to offer bad results-- bad things happened with
>>>>>>>> really hot water.   Also, no matter how much I left it in water--
>>>>>>>> registration was still never perfect-- so it almost seemed pointless.  And
>>>>>>>> then I discovered the perfect paper that required no pre-shrinking (up to a
>>>>>>>> certain size), and no sizing-- so I put it all out of my head after that. ;)
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> Diana
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> On Jan 17, 2013, at 1:03 PM, Denny wrote:
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> Folks, I did some simple testing to try to evaluate how to shrink 
>>>>>>>>> paper, details here:
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> http://www.dennisspector.com/technotes/preshrink.html
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> I was surprised by the results, and I'm wondering if anyone else has 
>>>>>>>>> looked at this closely, what did you find?  Any noticeable effects of 
>>>>>>>>> water temperature?  Amount of shrinking?  (I'm sure these vary with 
>>>>>>>>> different papers, and I know some papers may not require any 
>>>>>>>>> preshrinking.)
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>>>>>> Denny
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
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