Re: "speckling" v "staining " (was New Orleans/glut)

Clay,
I think on this list it was reported that it is 2.5% glut. I think Ryuji
said another brand is called Maxi-cide that is also 2.5%. I asked Maco for
an MSDS sheet and they returned an email saying check the website, but
darned if I can find the MSDS on the website for the hardener that is in
English...
http://www.mahn.net/Frameset.htm
That is the URL for the safety sheets but either I am doing something wrong
or they won't load. I think it is under Geladur there...
Chris
----- Original Message -----
From: "Clay" <wcharmon@wt.net>
To: <alt-photo-process-l@sask.usask.ca>
Sent: Saturday, September 03, 2005 9:41 AM
Subject: Re: "speckling" v "staining " (was New Orleans/glut)

> Chris and everyone,
>
> Some people have mentioned using the Black Magic hardener. Any idea what
> the strength of that stuff is? What sort of volume are you using in
> 1000ml of gelatin? I am debating giving that a try (with good
> ventilation!)
>
> Clay
> On Sep 3, 2005, at 10:15 AM, Christina Z. Anderson wrote:
>
>> Judy,
>>
>> Yes, Rives BFK.
>>
>> I agree that the term "speckling" can refer to different things. One
>> is, for instance, an all over grainy speckle that I attribute to such
>> things as overexposure or overbrushing that ends up leaving little
>> grainy bits of pigment all over the paper, including the highlights. It
>> looks like a robin's egg, with tone underneath.
>>
>> I also have had that speckling with white highlights that you talk
>> about, that I figured was Rives paper fiber at the very top picking up a
>> stain. Oh, for a microscope...
>>
>> Staining, though, can be in the form of a flat tone, when the color
>> sinks into the highlights and never releases (no grain), or a
>> combination of that flat tone and speckles in the highlights attributed
>> to both overexposure and unsuitable size, etc., or whatever reason of
>> choice causes staining (too acid gum, blah blah blah). So yes, speckle
>> and stain can be different things, can have different causes, but can
>> occur concurrently.
>>
>> My point is that a lot of beginning gummists get this speckle/ grainy
>> effect, and my guess is, that with a different paper and different size,
>> this would not happen.
>>
>> Maybe Mark could scan and post the speckle??
>>
>> My guess is, that Rives has little paper fibers that get brushed up and
>> extend past the size and don't get enough size, OR glyoxal crystallizes
>> gelatin in such a way, that catches and doesn't release pigment. Why
>> the latter guess is that my glyoxal coated FAEW hot press also speckled.
>> In fact, when I go back through my prints I did over the last 2 years
>> (probably about 500?) I can tell the glyoxal from the glut by feel and
>> look.
>>
>> I had Mark feel both the glyoxal Rives and the Fabriano AEW and he could
>> feel the crystally texture of the glyoxal. I also feel that texture
>> with formaldehyde, when I used to size with it. There is NONE of that
>> feel with glut either on hot or cold pressed papers. It feels smooth
>> and it acts smooth. BTW, my formaldehyde used to speckle, too.
>>
>> Plus, I can go back months later on a glut sized print and soak and
>> remove layers of gum with a scotch brite pad (thank you Jack Brubaker).
>> I cannot do that with an unsized FAEW or a Rives sized or not.
>>
>> Maybe I'm just lucky with glut, because I started out with Ryuji's
>> advice to use the 6ml of 2.5% per liter gum and it worked.
>>
>> The only way we can form a justifiable opinion on glut is if anyone
>> using it reports to the list and we develop a body of knowledge. Don
>> Bryant is doing so shortly. I hope others trying it will POST.
>>
>> If the topic of glut's toxicity comes up, remember that both
>> formaldehyde and glyoxal are very toxic, too. I personally would NOT
>> hang over a tray of glyoxal as a hardening afterbath any more than I
>> would hang over a tray of glut.
>>
>> BTW, I don't want to cast aspersions on Don's sizing method with Rives,
>> as his paper is perfect looking, flat, non-yellowed, and I think he did
>> rinse the glyoxal off after hardening. But, Don, did you separately tray
>> harden or put the glyoxal into the hot gelatin?
>> Chris
>>
>>
>>> Judy said: You seem to be using the terms "speckling" and "stain" here
>>> as meaning the > same thing. But as I use the terms they're distinctly
>>> different... the "stain" being a fine (although grainy) tone over the
>>> paper, the "speckling" being larger, possibly irregular but usually
>>> shinier *specks* of color, more widely spaced, that is there can be
>>> perfectly white paper between them.
>>> I've only seen what I call speckling in cases of faulty size, although
>>> *staining* can be from many causes, such as dispersal agent or other in
>>> the paint itself, or paper that tends to stain... (as some will always
>>> if not sized, eg. one particular Arches which I'd have to look up to
>>> name).
>>> And frankly my experience of the experience is so different from what
>>> you describe, I really do hope that's the explanation.
>>> The "Rives" here meaning Rives BFK, I assume, not one of the other
>>> Rives papers???
>>> Judy
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>
Received on Sun Sep 4 16:02:15 2005