RE: PT/PD MOGULS, MAESTROS & GURUS

[BOB KISS <bobkiss@caribsurf.com>]

DEAR CHRISTINE,
	Why not? Perhaps he knows a trick that we don't.  Believe me, I
would have preferred for the bleach to work!
		CHEERS!
			BOB

-----Original Message-----
From: Christina Z. Anderson [mailto:zphoto@montana.net] 
Sent: Thursday, February 15, 2007 10:23 AM
To: alt-photo-process-l@usask.ca
Subject: Re: PT/PD MOGULS, MAESTROS & GURUS

One more myth down the drain--thanks Bob for testing! Should we email Nadeau

and tell him?
Chris
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "BOB KISS" <bobkiss@caribsurf.com>
To: <alt-photo-process-l@usask.ca>
Sent: Thursday, February 15, 2007 7:12 AM
Subject: RE: PT/PD MOGULS, MAESTROS & GURUS


> DEAR ALL,
> Comparing the two halves side by side such that areas of tone are
> exactly aligned, I see no discernable difference in density anywhere from
> shadows through midtones to highlights.
> I DO notice a difference in the texture of the COT 320 paper,
> especially on the back side, which now feels much rougher or nappier.
> CHEERS!
> BOB
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: BOB KISS [mailto:bobkiss@caribsurf.com]
> Sent: Wednesday, February 14, 2007 1:56 PM
> To: 'alt-photo-process-l@usask.ca'
> Subject: RE: PT/PD MOGULS, MAESTROS & GURUS
>
> DEAR ERIC ET AL,
> I cut a processed test print in half so that I could compare tones
> from highlights to shadows.  I mixed 18 ml HCl (a little stronger than 
> 1:60)
> into one L of H20.  I presoaked one of the halves in water for 5 minutes 
> and
> then soaked it in the HCl clearing bath for 20 minutes.  It is washing as 
> I
> type.  I will report results when dry by comparing it to the half not
> treated in the HCl clearing bath.  .
> CHEERS!
> BOB
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Eric Neilsen [mailto:ejnphoto@sbcglobal.net]
> Sent: Wednesday, February 14, 2007 1:35 PM
> To: alt-photo-process-l@usask.ca
> Subject: RE: PT/PD MOGULS, MAESTROS & GURUS
>
> Bob, you'll notice that they sell HCL/muriatic acid in plastic bottles. I
> think you're safe there. Highly concentrated acid should be in glass, but
> weaker mixes you are ok with some plastics.
>
>
> Jeremy, I use Sodium Sulfite and both EDTA Di and Tetra sodium salts. The
> disodium has a lower pH and is used first in the clearing sequence. Early 
> on
> in my platinum printing experience, I assisted Chuck Henningsen with his
> printing out in Portola Valley, CA. We had a exhaust system in the 
> darkroom
> to pull out the fumes from our processes; B&W, Cibachrome in large tube 
> for
> processing 30" x 40", and pt/pd prints.
>
> It wasn't until we relocated to Taos, NM that I saw what it actually did.
> There was no vent to the outside, just into the attic. The studio had many
> canned lights that were unsealed, so the attic air was free to roam back
> down into the studio. Just about every piece of metal in that studio 
> should
> some signs of rust and corrosion.
>
> I occasionally use oxalic, citric and phosphoric acid and some hard to 
> clear
> papers. I also use a stronger mix of disodium/sulfite mix as well.
>
>
>
> Eric Neilsen Photography
> 4101 Commerce Street
> Suite 9
> Dallas, TX 75226
> http://e.neilsen.home.att.net
> http://ericneilsenphotography.com
> Skype ejprinter
>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: BOB KISS [mailto:bobkiss@caribsurf.com]
>> Sent: Wednesday, February 14, 2007 11:16 AM
>> To: alt-photo-process-l@usask.ca
>> Subject: RE: PT/PD MOGULS, MAESTROS & GURUS
>>
>> HI,
>> I am going to try the 1:60 HCl to water clearing bath.  Can I store
>> this dilute HCl clearing bath in a plastic bottle or must I use glass.
>> CHEERS!
>> BOB
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Eric Neilsen [mailto:ejnphoto@sbcglobal.net]
>> Sent: Wednesday, February 14, 2007 12:50 PM
>> To: alt-photo-process-l@usask.ca
>> Subject: RE: PT/PD MOGULS, MAESTROS & GURUS
>>
>> You may try it on a wet, freshly processed print first. I am home with 
>> flu
>> today, so no testing for a little while. : (  I will have to go out and
>> buy
>> some for testing. I have been using alternatives to the HCL for quite 
>> some
>> time.
>>
>> Eric Neilsen Photography
>> 4101 Commerce Street
>> Suite 9
>> Dallas, TX 75226
>> http://e.neilsen.home.att.net
>> http://ericneilsenphotography.com
>> Skype ejprinter
>> > -----Original Message-----
>> > From: BOB KISS [mailto:bobkiss@caribsurf.com]
>> > Sent: Wednesday, February 14, 2007 8:14 AM
>> > To: alt-photo-process-l@usask.ca
>> > Subject: RE: PT/PD MOGULS, MAESTROS & GURUS
>> >
>> > DEAR CHRISTINA,
>> > I do have HCl in the "pool cleaner" form.  I will see if I can do
>> > the 1:60 dilution test on one of the test strips that I have kept.  I
>> will
>> > tear it in half such that I have the same tones on both pieces, 
>> > "bleach"
>> > one
>> > and then do a dry comparison.  I may even get out my X-Rite and be
>> > somewhat
>> > scientific about it!
>> > CHEERS!
>> > BOB
>> >
>> > -----Original Message-----
>> > From: Christina Z. Anderson [mailto:zphoto@montana.net]
>> > Sent: Wednesday, February 14, 2007 12:39 AM
>> > To: Alt, List
>> > Subject: Re: PT/PD MOGULS, MAESTROS & GURUS
>> >
>> > Thanks, John, for saving me time locating my source; you are exactly
>> > correct.
>> >
>> > Eric, since you have hydrochloric acid (alas I was wrong, I only have
>> > sulfuric, nitric, and phosphoric) and since pt/pd is your process of
>> > choice,
>> >
>> > why don't you do a step wedge of each and tell us what you find?  BTW,
>> > John,
>> >
>> > I checked Neblette's 4th edition and I can't find the Nadeau  source
>> > there,
>> > even though there is a chapter on pt/pd.  Neblette quotes Clerc and a
>> > couple
>> >
>> > others, tho.
>> >
>> > But Bob, back to your original question--do you even have HCL and can
>> you
>> > see if a dilute mix will do what you need it to do? Isn't HCL that pool
>> > chemical stuff that one could get at a hardware store?
>> > Chris
>> >
>> >
>> > ----- Original Message -----
>> > From: "John Roseborough" <platinumprinter@msn.com>
>> > To: <alt-photo-process-l@usask.ca>
>> > Sent: Tuesday, February 13, 2007 11:59 AM
>> > Subject: Re: PT/PD MOGULS, MAESTROS & GURUS
>> >
>> >
>> > > Eric,
>> > >
>> > > In "The History and Practice of Platinum Printing" by Luis Nadeau 
>> > > (2nd
>> > > edition) page 32, Nadeau states that HCl is to be used highly diluted
>> to
>> > > 1% - 1.5% for Platinum and 0.5% for Palladium.
>> > >
>> > > John Roseborough
>> > >
>> > > ----- Original Message -----
>> > > From: "Eric Neilsen" <ejnphoto@sbcglobal.net>
>> > > To: <alt-photo-process-l@usask.ca>
>> > > Sent: Tuesday, February 13, 2007 8:46 AM
>> > > Subject: RE: PT/PD MOGULS, MAESTROS & GURUS
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >> Chris, WHERE is that note taken from?
>> > >>
>> > >> Eric Neilsen Photography
>> > >> 4101 Commerce Street
>> > >> Suite 9
>> > >> Dallas, TX 75226
>> > >> http://e.neilsen.home.att.net
>> > >> http://ericneilsenphotography.com
>> > >> Skype ejprinter
>> > >>
>> > >>> -----Original Message-----
>> > >>> From: Christina Z. Anderson [mailto:zphoto@montana.net]
>> > >>> Sent: Tuesday, February 13, 2007 8:43 AM
>> > >>> To: alt-photo-process-l@usask.ca
>> > >>> Subject: Re: PT/PD MOGULS, MAESTROS & GURUS
>> > >>>
>> > >>> Bob,
>> > >>> Even tho I have hydrochloric acid I have never used it to reduce a
>> > >>> print.
>> > >>> My notes say "palladium is more soluble in strong acids, so if you
>> use
>> > >>> hydrochloric acid, the traditional clearing bath, your dilution of
>> > that
>> > >>> clearing bath is 0.5%, not 1% as it is with platinum." I, too, am
>> > >>> interested
>> > >>> if this is wrong? And I wonder if it will work when using
>> > >>> NA2/palladium...hmmm...I have a too dark print, maybe I should just
>> go
>> > >>> do
>> > >>> it.
>> > >>> Chris
>> > >>>
>> > >>>
>> > >>> > DEAR PT/PD MOGULS, MAESTROS & GURUS ON THIS LIST,
>> > >>> > Please help me resolve what appears to be a conflict in both the
>> > >>> > literature and common wisdom.
>> > >>> > Here are the two conflicting bits of info:
>> > >>> > 1) You must not use a hydrochloric first clearing bath when
>> printing
>> > >>> with
>> > >>> > palladium as it will bleach the print, even though the
>> concentration
>> > >>> > should
>> > >>> > be around 1 to 1.5 %.
>> > >>> > 2) Recently, when I asked the list if there was any way to
>> slightly
>> > >>> reduce
>> > >>> > the density of a Palladium print I was told that the 
>> > >>> > concentration
>> > of
>> > >>> HCl
>> > >>> > necessary to have any effect would be so high that it would be
>> > >>> > dangerous
>> > >>> > to
>> > >>> > use in a regular darkroom and might have deleterious effects on
>> the
>> > >>> paper.
>> > >>> > I was told to just make another, lighter print.
>> > >>> > *********So, you can see my dilemma.  Is this not a 
>> > >>> > contradiction?
>> > >>> > 'Tis
>> > >>> a
>> > >>> > puzzlement!  Please enlighten me...as it were!
>> > >>> > CHEERS!> BOB
>> > >>>
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