U of S | Mailing List Archive | alt-photo-process-l | Re: question on sizing

Re: question on sizing


A blast from the past!!

This is verrry interesting, thanks to you and Judy for this tidbit.

Christina Z. Anderson
----- Original Message ----- From: "Keith Gerling" <keith.gerling@gmail.com>
To: <alt-photo-process-l@usask.ca>
Sent: Monday, September 08, 2008 10:45 AM
Subject: Re: question on sizing

I've had no problem with fish-eyes since I started adding a drop or
two of Kremer Defoamer (kremer # 78600) to my gelatin.  Judy turned me
on to this magic elixir many years ago and it seems to make life


On Mon, Sep 8, 2008 at 11:19 AM, Christina Z. Anderson
<zphoto@montana.net> wrote:
Thank YOU for all the stuff on acids, as well as all you other people! Now
I have one more thing on my plate to try--drop by drop in my gum mix. I
will post when done but with hobbling around now I am not too fast at
getting to things. BOY does that frikkin' cramp my style.

And DJ, never feel like a novice asking all kinds of questions. This is
what makes this list tick, and in a way we are all novices at alt.

As far as the book, I am looking for a publisher. Long explanation, but
here it is: if I want to use the book for my tenure case in 3 yr, it cannot
be self-published. However, if no publisher wants it (a single process book
makes NO money they say) then I will self-publish within the year and just
count it under my Teaching section of the dossier, which is what I did with
the Experimental Workbook and Alt Proc Condensed.

Do you all have all these ridiculous hoops in Europe as well? Well, I guess
they really aren't ridiculous, they're kind of challenging and even sort of
fun. Well, sort of.
PS Judy I have a transfer student from Pratt this year!

Christina Z. Anderson

----- Original Message -----
From: Dirk-Jan Treffers
To: alt-photo-process-l@usask.ca
Sent: Sunday, September 07, 2008 10:12 AM
Subject: Re: question on sizing
thanx Chris!

I'll try to experiment more with the sizing, since this is quite 'new' to
me. (For cyanotype it isn't necessary)...

and about your first comment: You're WAY more experienced them I am, so
you'll probablybe able to help with lots more things... I just need to make
sure I finally get the proces a bit more unde control, so I will be able to
identify problems and ask for solutions on this list. For now, me problems
mainly look like 'hmmm after three layers it looks far to reddish to me'.
And that kind of problems of course, i figure out on my own by either making
a fourth layer with extra blue, or using less pigment in my red layer, or
using a different kind of red pigment... for that kind of solutions by the
way, I find the website http://www.handprint.com/HP/WCL/water.html on water
colours VERY helpful... But i guess that's a website you guys already know
of course ;-) So in the future, be ware of more of my problems/questions ;-)
For now, I'm just lurking and reading on other peoples questions and
learning from that!

but than again, thanx for your help!


(by the way... I already have your book 'Alternative processes Condensed',
but I heard from Kees Brandenburg that you're working on a special book on
gum only. Any idea when that will be published???)

2008/9/7 Christina Z. Anderson <zphoto@montana.net>

Hi DJ,
So now I can help YOU. Those spots are called "fish-eyes". There are a
number of causes and this, too, plagued people back in the 1800's. They had
different explanations for it. I find that some pigments are oilier than
others--yellow rarely fisheyes for me but magenta does often. I thought
this was because I was usually using magenta as my last layer and thus there
was a slicker surface of exposed gum layers below to make it fish eye, but
when I use magenta as my first layer it does it.

You may be right in that your sizing is causing this, either by unevenness
or that the layer is a bit oily. How to get rid of them is let the layer
set for a few seconds and then brush, brush, brush, say, with a dry hake
brush to even them out. This sometimes works.

Otherwise, make sure your gum mix is not too liquidy, because when my
coating solution is less viscous this happens more often. So you might try
adding a little gum powder to thicken the layer so it doesn't separate.

As a last resort, do your gum print and fill in the missing color with
Prismacolor color pencils when the gum print is finished.

One 19th century explanation talked about at length in the British Journal
of Photography was that when the dichromate was added to the gum/pigment,
little balls of insoluble gum (like fish eggs) would form and "part the
waters" so to speak. One man professed to see it under the microscope,
these little globules. Who knows if this is correct, but it seems a bit far

I sympathize with you because fish eyes are a PAIN.

Christina Z. Anderson

----- Original Message -----
From: Dirk-Jan Treffers
To: alt-photo-process-l@usask.ca
Sent: Sunday, September 07, 2008 4:59 AM
Subject: question on sizing
dear list members,

I'm a novice at all these processes, so maybe you've encountered this
problem a thousand times allready, but maybe you guys (and gals) can help me

for tri-colour gum printing, I size my paper. Although I don't think my
paper (Arches Aquarelle, 300 g/m, i use both cold and hot pressed) doesn't
really need sizing, I last found this paper from bamboo that I like, that
actually does need it.

I size with a 3% gelatin solution, with glyoxal as my hardening agent.
After drying (single coat of gelatine-size), I notice that my
gym/pigment/dichromate solution doesn't really stick on some small parts of
the paper. When I use non-hardened paper, I need more of the gum-dichromate
solution to coat my paper (but I don't actually mind this.....). On the
hardened paper, I need less volume of gum-chrom. solution. But in general,
it works fine, but there are (often) small parts, where the paper looke tike
it 'rejects' the solution. Don't really know how explain this, but it looks
a bit like the paper on that particular spot, doesn;t absorb water-like

Does any one have any ideas on this? How to size in a way that these spot
son't occur any more? Or is sizing on Arches Aquarelle perhaps not even
necessary (an idea that I would really like, since this sizing stuff is
really boring....)?

Would love to hear your ideas on this issue!

kind reagrd,