From: Judy Seigel (jseigel@panix.com)
Date: 09/19/03-04:43:50 PM Z
On Thu, 18 Sep 2003, Katharine Thayer wrote:
> Katharine Thayer wrote:
> >
> , and I'm sure I used pigment numbers in that post. PB60 is not
> > PB66.
> >
I'm sorry Katherine didn't read the rest of my message re indanthrene,
because she might then not have so misconstrued it. She might even
possibly have learned a factoid or two, as I have.
For one admittedly trivial point,about the spelling: There seem, as I
noted past the point where she cut out, to be two spellings:
"Indanthrone" in Wilcox, and "Indanthrene" in Doerner and, I discovered
later, a caption (tho not the index) of "Colors."
But the main point to clarify (I daresay even FURTHER along) is that
although PB 66 may be CALLED "Indigo," it is not "genuine indigo," rather
an invention of the late 19th century. "Colors" has a fascinating chapter
on its effect on the local and international economy, but to quote Wilcox:
"Genuine Indigo [is] now obsolete in artists paints.... a valuable article
of commerce, it played an important part in the history of the East India
company. The importation into Europe virtually ceased after 1897 on the
introduction of a SYNTHETIC VERSION (emphasis added). Modern indigo
(THAT'S THE PB 66) has a poor reputation for lightfastness..." And, I'll
add, I see now that one of the 15 brands called "indigo" in Wilcox is
indeed based on this fugitive color, which is also called "Vat Blue 1."
That's the Grumbacher. The Schmincke has both PB 66 & thalo.
I repeat that the context was one-coat gum, & my point was that a paint
with good covering power is helpful. Thalo in various mixes, either from
the manufacturer & labelled "indigo," or in one's own mix has this, tho
it's not my color of choice for one-coat. I prefer more neutral for one
coat -- except sometimes PURE quinacridone red -- whoopee !!!
J.
> Katharine Thayer wrote: (Sept 10, 2003)
> >
> > I seem to have deleted the part about indigo. It's not entirely true
> > that indigo is no longer indigo, because at least two manufacturers
> > (Grumbacher and Schminke) still use PB66, the indigo that fades in blue
> > jeans. While those brands wouldn't be in my short list of artist-quality
> > brands, it's worth mentioning that indigo hasn't disappeared from paints
> > altogether, as suggested.
> >
> > As Judy says, and as I've pointed out a number of times, the convenience
> > mixtures now called "indigo" are mixtures of very different pigments.
> > The Daniel Smith "indigo" is indanthrone (PB60) +lamp black; the Rowney
> > "indigo" is pthalo blue + lamp black; the Winsor & Newton "indigo" is
> > pthalo mixed with quindacridone violet and lamp black; the Maimeri and
> > Holbein "indigos" are prussian blue mixed with lamp black. etc etc. This
> > is why it's so important (sorry, everyone, to keep harping on this) to
> > know what pigments are in the paint you use. If "indigo" has extreme
> > covering power, as Judy claims, it's probably because of the lamp black
> > in almost all of them, because the blues used across brands are quite
> > different in covering power.
> >
> > When I want an indigo-like color, I prefer to mix my own by mixing
> > indanthrone, PB60 (one of my favorite blues) with ivory black.
> > Katharine
>
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