U of S | Mailing List Archive | alt-photo-process-l | Re: Anybody experimented with Argyrotypes?

Re: Anybody experimented with Argyrotypes?



I see. Let's hope Sam's nice suggestion works for you then -> if you're
still interested in making Agryrotypes, that is. Also definitely try COT
320 (for whatever iron process), it's a really good paper. (If they didn't
changed it!) I was happy with my Argyrotypes because I was always toning
them with gold (which is pretty good priced in my location) -> which would
give convincing blacks almost every time... Never liked the results I was
getting with selenium and Vandykes (too yellow for my taste) therefore I
never tried to tone my Argyrotypes in selenium. I would prefer pt/pd every
time against Argyrotypes - no question! (Ease and quality.)

Is there any on-line gallery showing those prints?

To anyone: please let me know if you're coming to Istanbul/Turkey. I'd
like to meet (and provide any help you need - if I can - with utmost
pleasure).

Regards,
Loris.


21 Nisan 2009, Salı, 8:42 pm tarihinde, Paul Viapiano yazmış:
> Hi Loris...
>
> Yes, I did try using Tween, which sometimes helped a bit...
>
> Yes, the bleed is what I was experiencing...and...no hair dryer, just air
> dry.
>
> The papers were Platine, Fab EW, Arches cover, Rives BFK, Stonehenge and
> Bienfang 360.
>
> Extremely dilute selenium toning helped sometimes, as did acidification of
> the paper (except 360 which is neutral-acid already).
>
> I got maybe one good print (or at least acceptable) from each paper...the
> last time I made a few there were no good prints at all. Like I said, it
> is
> such an extremely fickle process and I'm not willing to pay $18 for a
> sheet
> of paper to make it work.
>
> Then again, I guess we pay up for chemicals (pt/pd) or paper (argys) to
> make
> it all work for us, eh?
>
> Best to you...
>
> Paul
>
> PS...by the way, I saw Linda Connor's exhibit at the CCP in Tucson, and
> there were a lot of images from Turkey! Would love to visit someday...
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Loris Medici" <mail@loris.medici.name>
> To: <alt-photo-process-l@usask.ca>
> Sent: Tuesday, April 21, 2009 10:02 AM
> Subject: Re: Anybody experimented with Argyrotypes?
>
>
>> Paul, have you tried a surfactant? (Tween or something like that. Never
>> did for Argrotypes but I was using Ilfotol w/o any negative effects for
>> Classic Cyanotypes.) Any sensitizer with AFC will have difficulties in
>> soaking into the paper, maybe you were experiencing just that?
>> (Indicated
>> by loosing image - if it's in the form of bleeding that is...) Were you
>> using a hair dryer à la platinum / kallitype? It's best to let the paper
>> in peace after coating for at least 10 minutes, to let the sensitizer
>> soak
>> in.
>>
>> All above in case of loosing image due bleeding. Which paper was that
>> BTW?
>>
>> Sam, were you diluting 1:1 or adding distilled water to make the coating
>> solutions volume 2x? For instance if your nominal coating soln. amnt.
>> for
>> 8x10" is 3ml you were using 1.5ml sensitizer + 1.5ml water or was that
>> 3ml
>> sensitizer + 3ml water? If the latter maybe the extra water was helping
>> the coating solution penetrate into the paper. If the former than that
>> is
>> a very interesting and useful piece of information!
>>
>> Regards,
>> Loris.
>>
>>
>> 21 Nisan 2009, Salı, 6:19 pm tarihinde, Paul Viapiano yazmış:
>>> ...
>>> PS...actually you know the biggest problem I have is in the first water
>>> bath clearing. I lose so much of the image here, even if I use
>>> distilled
>>> water or add an acidic factor, unless I get it out of there in 10
>>> seconds
>>> or so...
>>>
>>>
>>>   ----- Original Message -----
>>>   From: sam wang
>>>   To: alt-photo-process-l@usask.ca
>>>   Sent: Tuesday, April 21, 2009 7:30 AM
>>>   Subject: Re: Anybody experimented with Argyrotypes?
>>>
>>>
>>>   You might try diluting it 1:1 with water. It seems to work a lot
>>> better
>>> with most papers that way and DMax does not seem to be any lower.
>>> However, with good papers such as COT 320, it may be a lot easier to
>>> fix
>>> and wash thoroughly, and the tones are more smooth. For a cheap paper,
>>> Crane's Weston works reasonably well.
>>>
>>>
>>>   Sam
>>>
>>>
>>>   On Apr 20, 2009, at 6:16 PM, Paul Viapiano wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>     Yes...paper, paper, paper is so important. In fact, I will venture
>>> to
>>> say that MOST papers do NOT work with this process in any satisfactory
>>> way...
>>>
>>>     (hello...bitter...party of one?)
>>>
>>>     Paul
>>>
>>>     PS...did a previous post/reply from me on this subject get posted
>>> here? It never showed up on my end...hmmm
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>       ----- Original Message -----
>>>       From: fernando cruz florez
>>>       To: alt-photo-process-l@usask.ca
>>>       Sent: Monday, April 20, 2009 2:44 PM
>>>       Subject: Re: Anybody experimented with Argyrotypes?
>>>
>>>
>>>       My negatives are quite high-contrast as it is so it sounds
>>> perfect.
>>> Thanks so much for the all advice. I'll write again once I've had a
>>> chance to test it all out.
>>>
>>>
>>>       Thaks again,
>>>
>>>
>>>       Fernando Cruz
>>>
>>>       --
>>>       Fotografía y diseño.
>>>       Fernando Cruz Florez
>>>       Para ver mi portafolio entre a:
>>>
>>>       fernandocruz.fotografiacolombiana.com
>>>       www.fotografiacolombiana.com
>>>
>>>       http://www.flickr.com/photos/cgcentrodelaimagen/
>>>
>>> http://www.elangelcaido.org/muestras/2008/200812fcruz/200812fcruz.html
>>>
>>>       facebook  fernandocruzf@gmail.com
>>>       skype fernandocruzflorez
>>>       telefono 57 1 3232287
>>>       movil 57 3108686025
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>       2009/4/20 Loris Medici <mail@loris.medici.name>
>>>
>>>         You need pretty contrasty negatives for Argyrotype. Much more
>>> contrasty
>>>         than what you'd need for silver gelatin. If your negatives are
>>>         exposed/developed for s/g printing, I'm afraid you won't be
>>> able
>>> to get
>>>         nice contrasty/punchy Argyrotypes. (AFAIK, there's some
>>> contrast
>>> control
>>>         with the chemistry but I'm not sure if that will suit negatives
>>> optimized
>>>         for s/g printing.)
>>>
>>>         I don't think they're necessarily more stable than any other
>>> process
>>>         giving colloidal silver image on plain paper - as long as the
>>> images are
>>>         correctly processed/thoroughly cleared. Especially so when you
>>> choose to
>>>         tone your images with noble metals.
>>>
>>>         I had good results with Bergger COT 320 paper (the only paper I
>>> had used
>>>         for making Argyrotypes). As a rule of thumb, any paper that
>>> doesn't give
>>>         problems with New Cyanotype is also good for Argyrotypes.
>>> Search
>>> the web /
>>>         list archives for paper information.
>>>
>>>         If you extremely value image stability (and need the extra
>>> protection)
>>>         then you should definitely tone your Argyrotypes (or
>>>         Vandykes/Kallitypes/Salt Prints) with gold, platinum or
>>> palladium.
>>> But be
>>>         aware that toning for extra longevity comes with the price of
>>> changing the
>>>         original color of the image.
>>>
>>>         Regards,
>>>         Loris.
>>>
>>>
>>>         20 Nisan 2009, Pazartesi, 11:30 pm tarihinde, fernando cruz
>>> florez
>>> yazmıÅ&#65533;:
>>>
>>>         > Thanks again for the quick response...
>>>         > I have some negatives in black and white which I want to use
>>> for
>>> an
>>>         > exhibition using this technique (Argyrotype). I've read a
>>> couple
>>> of books
>>>         > which suggest that this process is more stable than a couple
>>> of
>>> other
>>>         > processes I was considering. Since you've experimented with
>>> this
>>> process
>>>         > are
>>>         > there any particular paper types (brands?) which you'd
>>> recommed?
>>>         >
>>>         > I will have to mix the chemicals myself since they're not
>>> available
>>>         > pre-made
>>>         > here in Colombia.
>>>         >
>>>         > I have some experience with the Bichromate Gum process from
>>> when
>>> I worked
>>>         > in
>>>         > Arte 2 Grafico (an artisanal/crafts workshop -
>>> http://artedos.com/ ) but
>>>         > this is the first time I'm experimenting with this particular
>>> process and
>>>         > the stability/longevity of the images to be used for the
>>> exhibition is
>>>         > very
>>>         > important.
>>>         >
>>>         > Any other advice would be very welcome and greatly
>>> appreciated.
>>>         >
>>>         > Sincerely,
>>>         >
>>>         > Fernando Cruz
>>>         >
>>>         > --
>>>         > Fotografía y diseño.
>>>         > Fernando Cruz Florez
>>>         > Para ver mi portafolio entre a:
>>>         >
>>>         > fernandocruz.fotografiacolombiana.com
>>>         > www.fotografiacolombiana.com
>>>         >
>>>         > http://www.flickr.com/photos/cgcentrodelaimagen/
>>>         >
>>> http://www.elangelcaido.org/muestras/2008/200812fcruz/200812fcruz.html
>>>         >
>>>         > facebook  fernandocruzf@gmail.com
>>>         > skype fernandocruzflorez
>>>         > telefono 57 1 3232287
>>>         > movil 57 3108686025
>>>         >
>>>         >
>>>         >
>>>         >
>>>         > 2009/4/20 Loris Medici <mail@loris.medici.name>
>>>         >
>>>         >> Fernando, I did. What exactly do you want to know?
>>>         >>
>>>         >> The first thing to mention is that it's a very picky process
>>> when it
>>>         >> comes
>>>         >> to paper choices; you have to use the best and purest
>>> papers.
>>>         >>
>>>         >> Also, it's better to tone the image in gold before fixing,
>>> if
>>> you value
>>>         >> longevity that is; colloidal silver in paper is pretty
>>> vulnerable... And
>>>         >> the color + darkness is beautiful that way. (Pt or Pd toning
>>> also is
>>>         >> possible, but, personally, I got best results with gold.)
>>>         >>
>>>         >> It's pretty easy to mix the solution - definitely more
>>> complex
>>> than
>>>         >> Vandykes (if you have to compound silver oxide yourself) but
>>> not a big
>>>         >> deal. Mix a volume enough for a couple of months (not longer
>>> than 5-6
>>>         >> months), the solution will deteriorate and silver out as
>>> time
>>> passes.
>>>         >>
>>>         >> Regards,
>>>         >> Loris.
>>>         >>
>>>         >>
>>>         >> 20 Nisan 2009, Pazartesi, 2:41 am tarihinde, fernando cruz
>>> florez
>>>         >> yazmıÅ&#65533;:
>>>         >> > ...
>>>         >> > I was wondering if there's anybody out there who's worked
>>> with
>>>         >> Argyrotypes
>>>         >> > willing to share their experiences and tips/tricks for the
>>> process.
>>>         >> > ...
>>>         >>
>>>         >
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
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