Re: Anybody experimented with Argyrotypes?
I see. Let's hope Sam's nice suggestion works for you then -> if you're still interested in making Agryrotypes, that is. Also definitely try COT 320 (for whatever iron process), it's a really good paper. (If they didn't changed it!) I was happy with my Argyrotypes because I was always toning them with gold (which is pretty good priced in my location) -> which would give convincing blacks almost every time... Never liked the results I was getting with selenium and Vandykes (too yellow for my taste) therefore I never tried to tone my Argyrotypes in selenium. I would prefer pt/pd every time against Argyrotypes - no question! (Ease and quality.) Is there any on-line gallery showing those prints? To anyone: please let me know if you're coming to Istanbul/Turkey. I'd like to meet (and provide any help you need - if I can - with utmost pleasure). Regards, Loris. 21 Nisan 2009, Salı, 8:42 pm tarihinde, Paul Viapiano yazmış: > Hi Loris... > > Yes, I did try using Tween, which sometimes helped a bit... > > Yes, the bleed is what I was experiencing...and...no hair dryer, just air > dry. > > The papers were Platine, Fab EW, Arches cover, Rives BFK, Stonehenge and > Bienfang 360. > > Extremely dilute selenium toning helped sometimes, as did acidification of > the paper (except 360 which is neutral-acid already). > > I got maybe one good print (or at least acceptable) from each paper...the > last time I made a few there were no good prints at all. Like I said, it > is > such an extremely fickle process and I'm not willing to pay $18 for a > sheet > of paper to make it work. > > Then again, I guess we pay up for chemicals (pt/pd) or paper (argys) to > make > it all work for us, eh? > > Best to you... > > Paul > > PS...by the way, I saw Linda Connor's exhibit at the CCP in Tucson, and > there were a lot of images from Turkey! Would love to visit someday... > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Loris Medici" <mail@loris.medici.name> > To: <alt-photo-process-l@usask.ca> > Sent: Tuesday, April 21, 2009 10:02 AM > Subject: Re: Anybody experimented with Argyrotypes? > > >> Paul, have you tried a surfactant? (Tween or something like that. Never >> did for Argrotypes but I was using Ilfotol w/o any negative effects for >> Classic Cyanotypes.) Any sensitizer with AFC will have difficulties in >> soaking into the paper, maybe you were experiencing just that? >> (Indicated >> by loosing image - if it's in the form of bleeding that is...) Were you >> using a hair dryer à la platinum / kallitype? It's best to let the paper >> in peace after coating for at least 10 minutes, to let the sensitizer >> soak >> in. >> >> All above in case of loosing image due bleeding. Which paper was that >> BTW? >> >> Sam, were you diluting 1:1 or adding distilled water to make the coating >> solutions volume 2x? For instance if your nominal coating soln. amnt. >> for >> 8x10" is 3ml you were using 1.5ml sensitizer + 1.5ml water or was that >> 3ml >> sensitizer + 3ml water? If the latter maybe the extra water was helping >> the coating solution penetrate into the paper. If the former than that >> is >> a very interesting and useful piece of information! >> >> Regards, >> Loris. >> >> >> 21 Nisan 2009, Salı, 6:19 pm tarihinde, Paul Viapiano yazmış: >>> ... >>> PS...actually you know the biggest problem I have is in the first water >>> bath clearing. I lose so much of the image here, even if I use >>> distilled >>> water or add an acidic factor, unless I get it out of there in 10 >>> seconds >>> or so... >>> >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: sam wang >>> To: alt-photo-process-l@usask.ca >>> Sent: Tuesday, April 21, 2009 7:30 AM >>> Subject: Re: Anybody experimented with Argyrotypes? >>> >>> >>> You might try diluting it 1:1 with water. It seems to work a lot >>> better >>> with most papers that way and DMax does not seem to be any lower. >>> However, with good papers such as COT 320, it may be a lot easier to >>> fix >>> and wash thoroughly, and the tones are more smooth. For a cheap paper, >>> Crane's Weston works reasonably well. >>> >>> >>> Sam >>> >>> >>> On Apr 20, 2009, at 6:16 PM, Paul Viapiano wrote: >>> >>> >>> Yes...paper, paper, paper is so important. In fact, I will venture >>> to >>> say that MOST papers do NOT work with this process in any satisfactory >>> way... >>> >>> (hello...bitter...party of one?) >>> >>> Paul >>> >>> PS...did a previous post/reply from me on this subject get posted >>> here? It never showed up on my end...hmmm >>> >>> >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: fernando cruz florez >>> To: alt-photo-process-l@usask.ca >>> Sent: Monday, April 20, 2009 2:44 PM >>> Subject: Re: Anybody experimented with Argyrotypes? >>> >>> >>> My negatives are quite high-contrast as it is so it sounds >>> perfect. >>> Thanks so much for the all advice. I'll write again once I've had a >>> chance to test it all out. >>> >>> >>> Thaks again, >>> >>> >>> Fernando Cruz >>> >>> -- >>> FotografÃa y diseño. >>> Fernando Cruz Florez >>> Para ver mi portafolio entre a: >>> >>> fernandocruz.fotografiacolombiana.com >>> www.fotografiacolombiana.com >>> >>> http://www.flickr.com/photos/cgcentrodelaimagen/ >>> >>> http://www.elangelcaido.org/muestras/2008/200812fcruz/200812fcruz.html >>> >>> facebook fernandocruzf@gmail.com >>> skype fernandocruzflorez >>> telefono 57 1 3232287 >>> movil 57 3108686025 >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> 2009/4/20 Loris Medici <mail@loris.medici.name> >>> >>> You need pretty contrasty negatives for Argyrotype. Much more >>> contrasty >>> than what you'd need for silver gelatin. If your negatives are >>> exposed/developed for s/g printing, I'm afraid you won't be >>> able >>> to get >>> nice contrasty/punchy Argyrotypes. (AFAIK, there's some >>> contrast >>> control >>> with the chemistry but I'm not sure if that will suit negatives >>> optimized >>> for s/g printing.) >>> >>> I don't think they're necessarily more stable than any other >>> process >>> giving colloidal silver image on plain paper - as long as the >>> images are >>> correctly processed/thoroughly cleared. Especially so when you >>> choose to >>> tone your images with noble metals. >>> >>> I had good results with Bergger COT 320 paper (the only paper I >>> had used >>> for making Argyrotypes). As a rule of thumb, any paper that >>> doesn't give >>> problems with New Cyanotype is also good for Argyrotypes. >>> Search >>> the web / >>> list archives for paper information. >>> >>> If you extremely value image stability (and need the extra >>> protection) >>> then you should definitely tone your Argyrotypes (or >>> Vandykes/Kallitypes/Salt Prints) with gold, platinum or >>> palladium. >>> But be >>> aware that toning for extra longevity comes with the price of >>> changing the >>> original color of the image. >>> >>> Regards, >>> Loris. >>> >>> >>> 20 Nisan 2009, Pazartesi, 11:30 pm tarihinde, fernando cruz >>> florez >>> yazmıÅ�: >>> >>> > Thanks again for the quick response... >>> > I have some negatives in black and white which I want to use >>> for >>> an >>> > exhibition using this technique (Argyrotype). I've read a >>> couple >>> of books >>> > which suggest that this process is more stable than a couple >>> of >>> other >>> > processes I was considering. Since you've experimented with >>> this >>> process >>> > are >>> > there any particular paper types (brands?) which you'd >>> recommed? >>> > >>> > I will have to mix the chemicals myself since they're not >>> available >>> > pre-made >>> > here in Colombia. >>> > >>> > I have some experience with the Bichromate Gum process from >>> when >>> I worked >>> > in >>> > Arte 2 Grafico (an artisanal/crafts workshop - >>> http://artedos.com/ ) but >>> > this is the first time I'm experimenting with this particular >>> process and >>> > the stability/longevity of the images to be used for the >>> exhibition is >>> > very >>> > important. >>> > >>> > Any other advice would be very welcome and greatly >>> appreciated. >>> > >>> > Sincerely, >>> > >>> > Fernando Cruz >>> > >>> > -- >>> > FotografÃa y diseño. >>> > Fernando Cruz Florez >>> > Para ver mi portafolio entre a: >>> > >>> > fernandocruz.fotografiacolombiana.com >>> > www.fotografiacolombiana.com >>> > >>> > http://www.flickr.com/photos/cgcentrodelaimagen/ >>> > >>> http://www.elangelcaido.org/muestras/2008/200812fcruz/200812fcruz.html >>> > >>> > facebook fernandocruzf@gmail.com >>> > skype fernandocruzflorez >>> > telefono 57 1 3232287 >>> > movil 57 3108686025 >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > 2009/4/20 Loris Medici <mail@loris.medici.name> >>> > >>> >> Fernando, I did. What exactly do you want to know? >>> >> >>> >> The first thing to mention is that it's a very picky process >>> when it >>> >> comes >>> >> to paper choices; you have to use the best and purest >>> papers. >>> >> >>> >> Also, it's better to tone the image in gold before fixing, >>> if >>> you value >>> >> longevity that is; colloidal silver in paper is pretty >>> vulnerable... And >>> >> the color + darkness is beautiful that way. (Pt or Pd toning >>> also is >>> >> possible, but, personally, I got best results with gold.) >>> >> >>> >> It's pretty easy to mix the solution - definitely more >>> complex >>> than >>> >> Vandykes (if you have to compound silver oxide yourself) but >>> not a big >>> >> deal. Mix a volume enough for a couple of months (not longer >>> than 5-6 >>> >> months), the solution will deteriorate and silver out as >>> time >>> passes. >>> >> >>> >> Regards, >>> >> Loris. >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> 20 Nisan 2009, Pazartesi, 2:41 am tarihinde, fernando cruz >>> florez >>> >> yazmıÅ�: >>> >> > ... >>> >> > I was wondering if there's anybody out there who's worked >>> with >>> >> Argyrotypes >>> >> > willing to share their experiences and tips/tricks for the >>> process. >>> >> > ... >>> >> >>> > >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >> >> >> > > > >
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